Episode 007: The Aaron Day Show/You Might Own Nothing Sooner Than You Think

I got to stand up because I'm just so excited about Bitcoin. I can't talk about it while sitting down. So anybody here that's sick of the government inflating the money supply to pay to kill people all around the world? Stop using their money. Use Bitcoin. The answer is here. We can put a stop to all of that. You don't have to support them in any way. start using Bitcoin. There are so many websites that accept Bitcoin now, more and more coming online every day. If you have a business, you need to start accepting Bitcoin. What Bitcoin allows every single person in this room and on the planet who has access to the internet, you can have your own private bank account, right?

account and it's impossible It's called a Bitcoin for the government to seize your account. It's mathematically impossible for anyone to block you from sending or receiving money with anyone else anywhere in the world. And if you're careful about how you use it, it can be done anonymously as well. This totally strips governments control over the money supply way. There's nothing they can do about it. There's no way they can stop it. The only way they could stop it would be to shut down the entire internet in the entire world, and that's not going to happen. This is what every libertarian's absolute dream come true. It's here, and it's called Bitcoin, and we need to spread the

word to everybody about it. And I'm glad you guys are here, and we're here to answer your questions about it. learning about it here today, And when you're done tell your friends, tell your family, help them set up Bitcoin wallets. Help tell everybody that you know about Bitcoin. Anytime you need to buy something, ask the merchant if they'll allow you to pay in Bitcoin. And anytime you receive U.S. dollars, convert them to Bitcoins, then use them as Bitcoins. We need to spread this, and the world is going to be a much, much, much better place because of it. And it's not a question of if this is going to happen. It's just a question of how soon it's going to happen. And with your help,

we can make it happen sooner rather than later. At the end of the day, I think there'll be know your customer this, there'll be anti-money laundering that, there'll be some tax regulations, there'll be some back and forth over what you can do, there'll be concerns about privacy. That's why I look at Bitcoin and I think, It's pretty clear. If the use case is store of value, well, like 7.8 billion people on Earth need a store of value, and probably the value of that is $100 to $300 trillion, right? That's enough. That's good. If the use case is currency, replace the dollar and the euro, that seems like it's, I mean, that's just intentionally inflammatory. We don't need to replace the

euro and the dollar. The bankers are going to be upset about replacing the euro and the dollar. I don't think it's going to happen and not in the next decade or two decades. So we don't need to get wrapped around the axle on that. And if the use case is medium of exchange and payment, like we don't really need to pay for a pizza with it. We don't need to pay for a Starbucks coffee with it. I mean, that's already solved by Alibaba and PayPal and Square and Apple Pay and Amazon and Google Pay. And it's, you know, they can be regulated and Visa and MasterCard. So you can leave Visa and MasterCard alone. You can leave the dollar and the euro alone. We can agree to pay taxes together.

We cannot, you know, we cannot.

Testing, testing, one, two, three. All right, now we got it. All right. Thank you, everybody. Sorry for the delay. Thank you, everyone, for coming. I know this was late notice, something a little bit different tonight, but I wanted to do in part because I just released this new article through Brownstone entitled, You May Own Nothing Sooner And I think it's an important article. Than You Think. It's actually something that I've been working on and thinking about over the last several months, actually, as I've been traveling around the country and exploring some new concepts in addition to the CBDC issue, really the tokenization of all of our assets, not just money,

The CBDCs deal with the issue of tokenized money, but basically all of our assets, stocks, bonds, our homes, our cars, everything is slated to be tokenized and could be controlled and censored by multiple third parties. So I wanted to put together this article. and lay it all out and it's a lengthy article. So I thought what I'd also do is kind of put together a presentation outline of it as well and then have three guests join us to talk about the, presentation to actually after I do this talk about it and have a little bit of interaction and then open this up as well to the audience for comments, feedback and questions. So with that, I'm gonna jump in and walk through the presentation

And so if you're here for the, you might own nothing you're in the right place. sooner than you think I'm going to walk through just a few housekeeping things from last time. If you didn't see my last show, I had a great interview with Ray Yousef, who is doing some incredible things in Africa. I encourage you to check out episode six. It's on Rumble and YouTube. I will have the podcasts up shortly, but he is really actually spreading peer-to-peer digital cash in the Southern Hemisphere and is just doing a phenomenal job. So it was great to have him on and hopefully we'll be collaborating at some point down the line. There are a ton of events coming up, and I wanted to walk

through that because the schedule's almost getting completely booked. We have maybe one or two more weekends that we're, you know, between now and the end of the year for scheduling CBDC workshops. So just to give you a heads up, I'm going to be speaking at Chris Martinson's Peak Prosperity Annual Summit. This is September the 13th through the 15th, and this is in New Hampshire, Lake Winnipesaukee. So this is going to be a great opportunity. I'm just doing two hours focused solely on solutions. His group is very educated on these issues. I learned a lot about the great In fact, taking from Chris and I've had a lot of conversations with him back and forth on this. So I'm literally just going

to be teaching people how to use crypto, how to download a wallet, how to use crypto gold and silver for their day-to-day living. So that's coming up in September. We just launched our next workshop that we're making tickets available for. It's October the 5th in central New Jersey. And so if you want to check that out, you can go to bit.ly forward slash NJCBDC. You can also get to all of this information at daylightfreedom.org. But this should be a great event. And we have a lot of great organizers working with this. Dan O'Neill and the Central New Jersey Libertarian Party and many other organizations. health freedom groups as well.

So very excited about that. We should have Nashville coming soon. We've had some logistical things and other things that came up. We might do something either later in October or possibly later in November. We'll stay tuned for details on that. I'm going to be going to Mexico City for Monerotopia, November the 14th through the 17th. So that's going to be a great event if you're interested in privacy coins. Monero is obviously going to have a huge presence. The folks from Zeno are going to have a huge presence. And I'm really looking forward to meeting some of these people in person that I've been talking to online in many cases for years. And so That's going to be a great event.

And if anybody is in Mexico City, I may do a CBDC workshop before or after if there's So I'm throwing that out there. sufficient interest. If it happens, it happens. If anyone kind of comes in and says, yeah, we can bring some people to an event, then I'd be happy to put one together. October the 12th through the 14th, I'm going to Argentina. I'm going to be speaking at the Bitcoin Cash Conference there. That is one of their big annual events. And so I'm very excited. to be participating in that and look for who knows, maybe Steve will be there. And it'll be a great opportunity to interact with all the bright minds that are that are working on incredible things with Bitcoin Cash.

Speaking at the Brownstone Institute annual gala, which is The dates were cut off. I want to say November the 2nd. It's basically the weekend before the presidential election. So this is going to be a must-see and must-attend event. It's in Pittsburgh, and it's going to have all of the people from Brownstone from a variety of different areas, from lockdowns to the censorship industrial complex to economic and financial matters. So keep your eye out for that. You can get tickets at brownstone.org. So with that out of the way, I'll jump right into essentially an overview of the content that is in this article that I wrote. And it really is focusing on

you might own nothing sooner than you think. And I want to explain that they have a very specific plan. I mean, this isn't just a bumper sticker or a tagline. that Klaus Schwab has put together, there are actual steps being taken to make all of that possible. And they're using technology and tokenization to really facilitate this. And it's very alarming, but it is something that we can do something about. And so I wanna walk through a few things. First, I wanna start with, because a lot of people, When you talk about something like tokenization, people don't know what tokenization is or why it even matters. And I guess to frame this properly, it's important to explain how commerce currently

works today and what's been going on over the last few decades in terms of our interaction with and signing of what are called click wrap digital agreements. So, you know, when you get a new piece of software or whatever, all these things that we just click on, you scroll through and then you click. These are serious legal agreements. And we have been signing these things. We sign an estimated 150 to 400 click wrap agreements per year. And these agreements, in these agreements, we are giving away our rights, we're giving away our privacy. It's incredible what's actually buried in these agreements. But of course, we don't read them because, as you'll see on the next slide,

it would take a significant portion of our lifetime to actually fully read all 150 to 400 of these agreements and even if we did read them and then we did decide we wanted to change them there's absolutely nothing we could do about it because what are you going to do make a red line and send it to the legal counsel at microsoft there's really no ability to do anything about this there was a study done I believe in 2016 where they actually tested people. And it turns out 74% of the people in the survey blindly accepted terms of service that involves surrendering not only their personal information, but to the NSA, but giving up their first born child to the service owners of the contract.

And of course, we shouldn't be surprised, right? Congress doesn't even read the bills that they vote on or write the bills that they vote on. So I guess to the extent they're the ones that make the laws and they don't read it or write it, I guess it's not too surprising that downstream from that, here we are as consumers blindly clicking away on these agreements. And so this is a very precarious situation. So I want to lay that as the background. So the background on this is we have been conditioned to sign digital agreements, giving away our rights. And this has been going on for two or three decades. And I mean, I like to call it, it's almost a life sentence of reading.

If you take a look at just three examples of this, Microsoft's licensing agreement is 70 pages long. So if you actually just don't, you know, the scrolling and everything, if you actually went through and printed that out, it would be 70 pages. Amazon has a 12,000 word conditions of use document that is part of what they're doing. And the agreement just to use Wells Fargo's online access, that's not even the totality of your banking relationship. This is just for the online part, it's 30 pages. So if you count up all of the words from all of these agreements, we would have to spend up to one hour every day, 365 days a year, just to read these

contracts that we are clicking our rights away through. So this, again, serious problem as the backdrop. And I'm going to actually even take myself out so This is a meme. that you can see this. that I thought was horrifying, but it makes the case for what we're saying here. And actually, this meme just popped up and this situation popped up after I wrote the article. But if you can't read the meme, it says, one of your restaurants on your hey, property caused my husband's death. I'm going to sue you. And the next panel here is, no, you can't. He signed up for Disney Plus, remember? And this is all referring to the fact that Disney is actually trying to dismiss a New York doctor's

allergy death because saying that they signed Disney Plus and the subscription terms of the Disney Plus online service would actually cover Disney for an allergy at one of their restaurants. So in other words, you've signed up so that your kids could watch Mulan or whatever's on Disney, and unbeknownst to you, that actually somehow provides some legal benefit or coverage for Disney at one of their restaurants. That is how ridiculous this is. Now, I hope they lose that case, but they might not lose that case. That's just a signal of how bad things are at this point. So with that as the backdrop, so we've signed away all of our rights, but there's another point

that I want to make. And I think that people don't think about this much. And this really applies to when we start talking about why tokenization is important. All of global commerce runs on centralized databases. Every time we buy or sell something, it is recorded in a database. If you buy a house, if you buy a car, stocks, bonds, everything is done through largely a centralized database. And this is the point that And I've never really heard people don't think about. anybody actually put it that way. But any industry that you go through, you can actually look at it and say, okay, well, Who's running the database? Who are the lawyers around it? How are banks tied into it?

What are the regulators and the politicians doing? How does insurance relate to this? technology providers that And then there are are actually fulfilling the management of these databases. implementation and And so this is the heart of commerce. The heart of commerce is a database. And for the most part today, databases are centralized you know microsoft database and oracle database tokenization is a very simple concept tokenization is very simply the evolution of the database so once you understand that the databases actually do in fact run things then you'll understand that tokenization is inevitable we're going to get tokenization of all assets the real question is are we going to get a

freedom-based tokenization or a tyranny-based tokenization? And I'll explain that a little bit more as we go through it. But these databases, I mean, this is really serious. I mean, obviously, you probably all saw that it was reported in the last few days that it looks like all of our social security numbers have been compromised. citizen, in fact, Every U.S. I think it's 2.9 billion social security numbers, which means dead people, like all of the social security numbers of all of the humans, not just the ones that are currently living at this point in time have been hacked. So once again, this speaks to this idea of centralized databases. It was estimated in 2017 that there was a trillion

dollars in financial losses due to database corruption. And that number was projected to be 10.5 trillion by 2025. Based on that source that I saw, which is probably outdated, I am sure the financial losses from databases are going to far exceed $10.5 trillion by 2025. And if you look at all of the middlemen and service providers and lawyers and everything involved with managing this centralized database and system of commerce, it can be, depending upon the industry, as much as 30 to 40% of revenue. is involved with unnecessary costs and inefficiencies and intermediaries related to all of this. And so, you know, you have on top of that, the ability for account closures, you know,

data exploitation, on and on and on. So again, databases are here. I'm not saying that databases are horrible. We're better off with databases than we would be if we didn't have databases. However, at this point in time, database technology is knowingly an issue, and it's knowingly something that has been corrupted, is corruptible, and this is a problem that gets worse by the day. And actually, before I go into this next point, I want to give an example of this as it relates to money. The dollar is... Well, actually, you know what? I will get to that. But we already have a central bank digital currency. The Federal Reserve runs on an Oracle database. I'll throw that out there as

a teaser and we'll get back to that. But truly, our money currently is controlled using a series of databases. Each bank has their own database. The Federal Reserve has a database and their databases interact with one another. So that is the heart of money itself. And it's the heart of the transfer and sale of all other assets, stocks, bonds, houses, cars. Again, you have a car title, you have a house title. All of those things are controlled in a database and moved through a database. So with that is the backdrop. So we've been signing for decades our rights away through these online agreements, all of commerce runs through centralized databases. Now we get to the issue of

talking about tokenization. And a lot of people lump all technology together, either all technology is bad, all technology is good. And the truth is that technology is is neutral. It's all about the type of technology and the intent of the people implementing it. So tokenization can either power individuals or it can actually lead to absolute tyranny. It can lead to a situation where all of our assets are controlled and programmed by one or more parties. And so we're talking about a situation here where the wrong type of tokenization could lead to the complete erosion of digital ownership. And in fact, that's what I think is actually going on right now behind the scenes.

So I want to talk about one element of tokenization. So again, global assets, when we're talking about all of the assets on the planet, we're talking about more trillion dollars worth of global assets. than one and a half Money is just one part of it. Money is like 5%. So just start thinking about things as once you start thinking about what all assets are, are digital already, usually in a centralized database, they're all going to be tokenized. So let's focus on the tokenization of money. What are the types of ways that money can be tokenized? And there are closed systems. And so this is what we're dealing with, with the CBDC implementations that are going on all around the world.

And as a recap here, Today, 134 countries representing 98% of the global GDP are at one phase or another of either researching, piloting, or rolling out a CBDC. 11 countries have already rolled out a CBDC. There are more CBDC accounts globally than crypto accounts. That is the actual state of things right now. They haven't all been great implementations. It's perfect, but what I am saying is you compare the 134 countries now to four years ago, where only 35 countries were at just the research stage. Relative to crypto, Crypto has actually decreased in use.

Last month, according to the Federal Reserve, only 0.4% of Americans used crypto to buy engaging commerce. 0.4%. It was like 2% two years ago. So there's actually a decline. And the rate of growth and development and investment on CBDCs is huge. But these are closed systems. So these are systems that you have to get permission to use them. And the transactions themselves, it's not a transparent ledger. You can't see what's going on. Only those in control can see the transactions and only those in control can provide access to the money itself. they can shut off that money. And by extension, So that's what CBDCs are. You have completely open systems like Bitcoin and Ethereum.

These are cryptocurrencies where anybody can use them but the downside is all of the transaction information is available. there may be some things that you can Now, do to make it a little bit more private, but for the most part, the steps that you actually have to take are overly cumbersome. I mean, at the end of the day, this is money. If you have to take multiple steps to protect your privacy, if it's not privacy by default, it's actually kind of a challenge. And this is an issue. Obviously, gold backs cash. You don't need to understand technology to understand how to use cash. But, you know, these open systems are there are benefits to that. it's certainly better than closed I mean,

systems. And, you know, I think that there are a lot of people who had the view that, you researching this for Because I've been another article that I'm writing that, wouldn't it be great if everybody well, had a transparent system, governments included? And so if everybody's on a transparent system, then maybe we can actually eliminate corruption and we can actually have sound money for the world. And that's a great idea. I love it. But... that's not actually what's happening in reality. You can go to the Atlantic Council website and you can start digging into what's actually being built. And the central banks and governments are not building open systems. You have what are

transparent gated systems. And so these are kind of systems where there may be, know your customer, impediments to actually there may be some getting access to the things. But the transactions themselves are transparent. I put, roughly speaking, I mean, you could have nuance around this, but I put stable coins like Tether and USDC in this category. And then you have privacy coins that are open. So anybody can use these coins, but they're private. So there's no open public transparent blockchains. And so I put Zeno and Monero in those categories. And then I've added a category. I didn't really frame it this way in the article, but where they're going with this,

the evolution of CBDCs is actually to morph towards a single global digital currency. where that single digital currency is backed by energy credits. This has been the dream of the technocrats since the 1930s. And this isn't just either a pipe dream or a conspiracy theory. You can type in and I'll post the comment right now, Doconomy MasterCard. You can Google that and you will see that there is already a credit card in existence that is branded with the United Nations Climate Action No. 13 Strategic Development Goals. So it's a UN-branded MasterCard that shuts off

when you use too much carbon. Now, obviously, in order to be able to have a card like that, that means several things. It means that MasterCard has already formed relationships with a whole companies to be able to track the carbon. bunch of different And in fact, they have. There are over 150 partner companies that are working with MasterCard. ranging from airlines to restaurants to you name it. BMW is on the list. It's a wide and growing list. So just understand what this means. They've already put in place the tracking of carbon and the ability to shut off your ability to use money. So they've been working on and developing this infrastructure. This isn't some, gee,

they really would like to do something like this. They've actually already built the underlying framework for it all. So those are the types of tokenized money. The first four are, relevant today. This last one is what I think the end goal is and what it is that we're trying to prevent. So I want to switch gears a little bit and talk about CBDCs. This is another article that I'm working on right now. So we already have a CBDC. We can sit around and we can talk about different definitions, and people have different definitions. There really isn't a commonly understood, widely shared definition of what a central bank digital currency is. So I'm going to go ahead and use what the words mean as

a way to define it. A central bank, like the Federal Reserve, digital currency, a currency that is in digital form. Well, that is exactly what we have today. And I touched on that earlier. So today, the government issues an IOU to the Again, Federal Reserve. The Federal Reserve takes that IOU and puts into an Oracle database an account with digital money that has been printed out of thin air. And that's what the federal government uses, is uses that account in that database to pay all of its bills. That is a central bank digital currency. And then the federal government writes these checks, pays employees, pays vendors, and an employee will get a check or a vendor will get

a check and then they'll go to a bank like Citibank or Bank of America and they'll deposit that check into a database. So Citibank may have a Microsoft, I haven't investigated what Citibank specifically has. They might have a Microsoft SQL database where they track this. And so based on, let's say you deposit $100,000 into Citibank, Citibank can then actually create another $900,000 worth of database entries into their Microsoft database and start giving that out to customers as well. They just need to keep a certain amount And they have to interact with the Federal Reserve's Oracle database to make sure that there's enough in the ledger for them so that

they can do interaction with other banks. This is literally how the system currently works. It's absurd for a whole variety of reasons. And as I've been digging into this, I mean, there are banks that for doing their own transaction processing are still using systems built on the COBOL programming language. The more I dig into the layers of processing, and I'm not gonna go into all of it here, but I'm amazed that the system works at all. But needless to say, there is a central bank And that is the basis of the digital currency. system that we have now. So now I put up there 50 shades of CBDCs. So because I'm even trying to figure out what these politicians are debating and discussing.

And I will do a separate podcast where I analyze and go through all of the bills. The short form of it is there's no difference between Republicans and Democrats at the end of the day. The Democrats are pushing a changing the central bank digital currency that we have now from being one that's in a centralized database like Oracle to being tokenized. That's the Democrat version. The Republican version says, well, we don't want the central bank doing that. We want the commercial banks to be able to issue stable coins. So in other words, the commercial banks will be able to tokenize their databases, tokenize their currency. In the end, it's the same thing. what you end up having is In the end,

programmable digital money. And I've actually been trying to compare what's the difference between the U.S. 's current digital currency in China. And for the most part, we already have the same surveillance, by the way. There's an interesting thought on this that, so if you look at the Bank Secrecy Act, if you look at KYC AML laws, if you look at NSA bulk collection, of financial information. If you look at the fact that almost every major bank, the contract, if we go back to the click talking about before, wrap agreements we were go look at Bank of America or Wells Fargo's agreements. In the contract, it already says they can sell or share your transaction information

with third parties, and they do that. These banks already work with the IRS using AI to analyze your transactions. So we're sitting around worried about the CBDCs. There's nothing more to worry about. The bad thing is already here and it's been implemented. So when they say they're going to ban CBDCs, I'm not sure. So they're going to ban the existing system? Are we going to stop using Oracle? And there's going to be quite an analysis on this, but at the end of the day, If whether they tokenize the money or not, they could use what are called APIs with the existing system to make the existing Oracle and Microsoft databases more programmable. And this would not require a law from Congress.

This wouldn't violate any of the current situation. And so, you know, I want to be very clear that we really do already have a CBDC and the real threat is the dollar today. It's fiat currency. It's not the potential future of CBDCs. We already have a tyranny system now. They can already shut off access to our money, which they've done with people like Kanye West and Dr. Joseph Mercola and Nick Fuentes and gun groups and everything else. They can already do that. They can already monitor our money. The only thing that really comes next is... much more granular programmability and the ability to determine whether or not we can even use our money, which certainly is scary.

But the situation that we have right now is bad enough. Like it is tyrannical enough that we should be moving away from it. The only thing then that remains is that there is about 8% physical cash. So that is one thing that is a, bank digital currency and but you can have a central cash at the same time. But I suspect where they're going to go is the actual banning of physical cash. And again, that'll be a bipartisan thing. It'll be a terrorist attack. You'll catch monkey pox if you touch actual physical currency. They actually tried to push that during COVID. I actually remember Time Magazine had a cover story or something, or the Economist, one of them had actually a cover story about germs

being carried on physical currency. So this programmability and tokenization is the next level, but we really already have a So that's where we are with that. And I'll get to what the solution is. And the punchline is, obviously, if you've been following me at all, the punchline is to stop using the dollar and to start using other alternative assets that are outside of the system. I have changed my thinking on the importance of privacy relative to this, which I will get to towards the end. So we've talked about now All right. tokenization of money. That's 5%. What about everything else? What about the tokenization of your house, your car, your stocks, your bonds, your 401k?

So there are three different models at a high level for that. There's one model that I call public permissionless tokens. And that is something, this is a project that I've worked on for a number of years called Ravencoin. Ravencoin is basically, it's a fork of Bitcoin that where you can create tokens without smart contracts. You create your own token, register the token, you can trade the token, and it's just like Bitcoin. It's all on a public ledger. Anybody can use it. You can trade the tokens anywhere in the world, and I've used it. I've actually bought and sold and traded wine, art, silver, any of a variety of different things using this approach. And so in that sense, it's like Bitcoin.

The upside is anybody can use it. The downside is, as we all know now with Bitcoin, is you can actually track who is doing what if you use sophisticated chain analysis and AI, which is increasingly being done. The second, which you can't see very well, type of tokenized asset are called permission systems. And again, this is like the analog to the CBDC and the previous conversation. This is a ledger where you will tokenize your assets, but where the tokens are centrally controlled and can be programmed, monitored, and censored by third parties. And in fact, What happens here is there's a specific system that's

regulated liability network. being developed called And you can look this up. You can Google regulated liability network. This is a pilot project between MIT, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, five large banks in New York area, the Bank for International Settlements and others. And so their idea here is to have one platform where you have CBDCs and all of your other tokenized assets in one place. when you dig into what they're building, The thing is, they're designing this in a way where Europe has one as well. The UK has one, Japan has one, and they're designing these to interoperate. So what that means is they're building a system where there's going to be one platform

one global platform for all tokenized assets and all CBDCs. So that is what they have been funding while, you know, crypto has been working on meme coins and NFTs. The answer to that is, you know, I think privacy tokens are a my opinion, big piece of this. And so you'll hear me talking about Zeno and I'm going to talk at the end, you know, I'm going to, put together a one pager on my website to explain to people I use multiple assets. I'm not a maxi in, in, in anything. And so if I write about one particular token, people automatically say, Oh, well, you're, why are you a, you're, are you a shit coin or are you just like that token? I'm just writing about this application No, for this token.

I use multiple assets. cryptos and tokens. I live on crypto and I can tell you anybody who thinks there is a single cryptocurrency for everything is mistaken. If you actually try to live on these things, you will find that out. I'm not sure though, that I, at this point, I think one of the things that I've changed in my thinking is, um, I I'm not sure that trying to find one single currency is the answer. That doesn't even seem like a very decentralized or libertarian approach to begin with. And I understand why people are pushing it, but I I've kind of I can tell you that in the short term, if we're going to defeat CBDCs and if we're going to defeat regulated liability network,

it is going to require multiple assets, including precious metals and multiple cryptos. So with that, so now I think we've got an understanding. Assets are going to be tokenized, non-monetary assets, monetary assets. But now I want to talk a bit about the great taking. And I encourage you to look this up. You can Google this. It's free on YouTube. There's a PDF version of the book that's free as well. It's The Great Taking by David Rogers Webb. I've met David. I've actually met and I've the last four months spent a lot of time over actually working with people, with David and people that he's been working with to go all around the country on a state by state basis to try to stop what I'm

about to tell you. So in essence, what has happened is starting in about 1994, some of the larger players in the financial services field went to all 50 states and got changes in what's called the Uniform Commercial Code. And without getting too technical, I'll, I'll let you know what the, the upside of this is that when there is a major financial collapse, so, you know, so we have our, well, people do, I don't, but our stocks and bonds and our 401ks are all through third parties. They're all through brokers. We don't have physical possession. We don't have stock certificates. We don't have, in fact, when people say BlackRock owns all of these companies,

the irony is that it's our money. We invest in 401ks and their financial instruments, and then we give them the voting rights, by the way. So talk about going back to what we do with these click wrap agreements. When people say that BlackRock and Vanguard and State Street own all those companies, no, it's actually our money, attention and we've but we haven't paid actually given them the voting rights. So they're voting our shares. We never get a vote. But in the case of the next great financial crisis, if Fidelity or BlackRock or any of these brokers go away, there's been a system that's been put in place through these changes in the uniform commercial code where the largest banks

will end up owning all of our assets in a bankruptcy. We will be like fourth or fifth down on the list in terms of priority of getting our assets back. And it's a system that through a combination of both these changes at the state level and to something called safe harbor protection that actually does give just the largest banks preferred access. So this is really a Citibank, Wells Fargo, JPMorgan Chase and Bank of America. Those four will basically sweep up. everyone's assets when there is a major financial collapse. And I will tell you, just like with banks, when we had that mini banking collapse last year, we blew through entirely the FDIC reserve.

It would be eaten up even faster when we talk about a stock market collapse. There's less insurance for stocks, bonds, and all these other assets than there is on a percentage basis, even relative to the amount of money that we have in banks. So 401ks are a scam. And I would actually go one step further to say it's actually a social credit system because when you study, there was a thing called the Revenue Act that was passed under Carter with Democrat majorities in the House and the Senate. that kicked off these 401ks and if you think about it it's they use incentives and penalties you know you can get matching funds and use pre-tax dollars from your employer you have to

hold until you're 59 and a half if you take your money out before you're 59 and a half you have to pay a penalty and you have to pay ordinary income tax I mean you know people talk about crypto scams with oh these people did this I mean our entire retirement system is a socially engineered I would call it social credit score. And the main reason that the stock market has gone up isn't necessarily because of anything fundamentally related. People are putting money into stocks. They don't even know what they own. Every two weeks or however often people get paid, it's going into these funds. They don't even know what's in it. It's being managed by BlackRock. BlackRock votes all the shares.

What a scam. But I will tell you, the reason that we got here is before we had 401ks, large companies would have defined benefit retirement plans where you would put in a certain amount, but then you would get a guaranteed amount out that's not tied to what you put in. And so, of course, that doesn't work unless the company keeps on growing exponentially, which it turns out doesn't happen with the automotive industry and the airline industry and everything else and so a lot of these pension funds imploded and they had to come up with a fund to bail out parts of the pension fund and so then they just said well look rather than having this defined benefit thing let's just set up

this preferential thing where people keep dumping money into the stocks they don't have a guaranteed outcome but if everybody's kind of playing in the ponzi then people will believe that they have stability in their basis of of our retirement system so retirements and that's the So now understanding this, we have regulated liability network, we have CBDCs, we have the great taking, which basically says legally in a collapse, everything is going to get wiped out. But let's talk about the four steps to how you will actually own nothing. So the first step is you implement CBDCs, which again is ongoing, 134 countries. But when you dig in deep, you find that the IMF, the World Bank,

The World Economic Forum and the UN are working together and collaborating on toolkits and policy for how to design these things. There's a lot of information sharing. For instance, I saw recently that the group that is working on the US retail CBDC is now working with Germany. This really is being designed centrally. it may look like different countries are experimenting with different things, but kind of only as a trial they're all moving towards and error thing, a more of a standardized approach. So first you implement CBDCs, then you integrate CBDCs with tokenized assets that are centralized and can be programmed, managed and censored by third parties in the exact

same way the CBDCs can be controlled. Then you interconnect the various regulated liability networks. Once you go through that process, you have one platform one global platform with all assets and all cbdc's and then at that point in time you just simply flip the cbdc's to being backed by energy credits and boom there is your global technocracy where the 17 sustainable development goals of the un are elements of a social credit score that are all tied to energy usage uh through this system so that that in essence is is how that works. So what is the solution? Now, you know, I'm sure people are going to start saying, what about this coin? What about this coin? And as I said, I'm not,

I'm telling you what I'm using. I'm going to put up a one pager because sometimes what I use changes. I mean, like for instance, Bitcoin was, was hijacked. I used to use Bitcoin, right? I recommend by the way, separately, read, read, uh, read this book, read, read hijacking Bitcoin, you know, uh, Other projects could be hijacked in the future. I'm not going to stay for certain on the maxi on any particular coin because these things all change. But right now, I will tell you that my focus, and it wasn't like this even 90 days ago, because of what they're doing with CBDCs, because of what they're and in particular, doing with regulation,

Coins that are these open coins like BTC and Ethereum, well, they're tracking those. And in essence, they're making it so that it's not fungible. Because if I can track the identity of certain coins, then I can put those on a white list or a black list, which means that not all money is the same. And that's exactly what's going on. Even to the point now where the FBI has come out and said, if you buy Bitcoin in a pool that was tainted with other illegal activity, involving drugs or whatever, then they can actually come and claw back your coins. So in essence, this is the challenge and the threat of these open systems. And I used to not think that that was much of a threat.

And now when I look at the totality, of what has been done with Executive Order 14067 and what Biden has done. If you look at it, I mean, we're down to four major exchanges in the US. They're all being sued by the SEC. I know people personally who are in prison for selling Bitcoin or in the case of Roger Ver, I mean, he's out on bail, but, you know, they they're going after him for alleged tax things from 10 years ago after he actually relinquished his citizenship. this is a chain analysis in AI And again, from 10 years ago, completely trumped up, frankly, in my opinion, to shut him up from talking about his hijacking Bitcoin book.

The people that worked on Tornado Cash, many people are in prison and are facing jail time. And they have been tightening the screws on this. So they can do these things. And so the best way around that is to use things that they actually can't track and can't monitor. So I've moved with an emphasis on privacy tokens. I like Zeno, which I'll talk about when we get to digitizing other assets. I like Monero. Those are the ones that I use the most. I put Zcash on here. I don't use Zcash that much, but it is a privacy coin. I like and use Bitcoin Cash. I've mostly used Bitcoin Cash since I've been living on crypto. And Bitcoin Cash has something called Cash Fusion. So there is an ability.

It's an extra step, but you can add privacy functionality to Bitcoin Cash. And I want to say this, that the current system that we have, the Federal Reserve, system can do a thousand transactions per second. Their Oracle database does a hundred thousand transactions per sec, or I mean, excuse me, a thousand transactions per second. That's not to say that that's the total size of the amount of money moving around on the system, because each bank has their own system that does, you know, a large bank like a Citi or JP Morgan may do 30,000 transactions per second themselves. It's just the settlement layer with the Federal Reserve. That's a thousand transactions per second.

The CBDC pilot, Project Hamilton, that they've developed can do 1.8 million transactions per second so as much as I like xenon as much I like monero or zcash there's no ability to onboard a large number of people and so something like bitcoin cash has actually put together a dynamic block sizing. They've changed that so that it can actually expand and handle more transactions per second. So those things are needed. Litecoin is another one that has implemented something called Mimblewimble. So you can use Litecoin and have privacy. And I've used Litecoin as well. There are times where... You know, again, depending on if you're living on this stuff, you know, I used to use primarily

Bitcoin Cash and then I would use BitPay if I needed to use a debit card and they shut that down. And so that I needed to use Litecoin and I'd switch to Litecoin and use this. So it's absolutely a requirement to keep an open mind. And if anything, I mean, I'm going to Monero conferences, Bitcoin Cash conferences. My call to everybody is we all need to work together. and come up with solutions for merchants and consumers that are easy to use because what they're building is an existential threat to the entirety of crypto. And by the way, also to precious metals. So I have, you know, those aren't the only four crypto, but those are the primary ones I use. And by the way,

I will be evaluating others. I also use goldbacks.com. And I have an account with Goldback and I can actually put gold and silver onto a debit card if need be. I use physical silver and I'm exploring the idea of privacy tokenized gold and silver. So here's the thing. If I buy these Goldbacks and let's say I go to my barber or I buy something or I usually tip with these things. There are a couple of merchants. there are 150 merchants in New Well, Hampshire in 2000. nationwide where I can actually pay for things outright. But once I hand this gold back to somebody, it's theirs. This is like cash. This is completely fungible. Nobody knows who has what. It's not tracked. But if I use the online

system for gold backs, it's in a centralized database. It's not even tokenized. It's completely KYC and it's completely tracked. So what I'm talking to them about is what if you could have the Ability to back a token by gold or gold backs But then also have them be privacy tokens so that you could actually protect your identity and what I'm envisioning here is a system where imaginative a Merchant can accept multiple forms of payment bitcoin cash litecoin all these they take bitcoin cash kind of behind the scenes There's a swap that goes on they get paid in privacy gold back tokens on a delivered on like let's say an nfc card where they can go to an ATM and actually redeem the

privacy tokens for physical gold without being KYC-ed or identified. That's the kind of solution that I think that we need. We need to bring all of these features together, all of these different projects that have great features and functionality, bring them all together. I use Cake Wallet right now because it has a lot of these coins. It has Litecoin, has Bitcoin Cash, it has Monero, it will soon have Zeno. You can actually buy gift cards and debit cards right from within the app. It has a lot of really cool functionality. That kind of thing is what's needed. And we need something similar for a point of sale system. And then for how we defeat the non-monetary asset tokenization,

this is where I put Zeno. This is why I'm actually interested in Zeno. So if anybody's asking or you're sitting there, it's like, oh, why are you pushing this coin? because I've been working I'm pushing this coin on tokenization since 2018. I have literally been, you know, you can look for Ravencoin. I was working every project, anything anybody was tokenizing, I was buying and selling it. My kids tokenized NFTs when they were 10 years old. My daughter sold the first NFT on Ravencoin when she was 10. And so I've understood for a long time the importance of tokenization. However, just like with... With the encroaching CBDCs, we need a privacy solution that the government

literally can't see and take. We need a similar solution for assets. I'm working on a separate thing. I have a spreadsheet where I've looked at the 50 largest categories of assets globally. And it's like a total. It's well over one and a half trillion dollars. But you can see what the biggest categories are. Derivatives. residential real estate, bonds, stocks, currency. I mean, you can tokenize anything of any size. confined to earth. It doesn't even have to be You could tokenize mineral rights on an asteroid. One of the things that I had put together for Ravencoin was an appeal to Elon Musk to tokenize, to create a blockchain tech stack for human civilization for Mars,

tokenize the supply chain, tokenize the capital markets, tokenize voting. That is how powerful this is. And if you do it right. And so I still like Ravencoin, but right now I believe we are in a crisis of non-ownership and we've already given it away legally. And now we're about to give it away through this digital tokenization. So I'm going to be experimenting with it. With all that said, it's a fairly new project and actually the tools, for doing the tokenization and swapping and everything else are new and they're early. So when I say this, I mean, I love the concept of Zeno and I've loved playing around with it. There's certainly more that needs to be built, but I'm viewing this as Zeno

could be the basis for an international barter system when all hell breaks loose. And those other cryptos and alternative assets that I mentioned in the previous slide, that's how we defeat CBDCs. So just a little bit of context. And I want to say, I know this is going long, but we can beat the technocrats. often people say to me, well, you know, the masses aren't going to buy this or, how are you going to get people you know, to understand this? And there's a misconception that ideas never start with mass adoption. Everything goes through a stage. I listened to G. Edward because he was actually Griffin talk about this talking about the same concepts. The concept in

for technology companies called crossing the chasm. You have innovators, which could be anywhere from actually 0.5% to two and a half percent. And those are the people They're playing with things. that are early on. like to tinker. They're all right with taking risks. They like to try to make new things happen. And then that group, and I'll actually even say differently, you need a half percent to get to 3%, and then that 3% gets you to 13 and a half percent. These are these early adopters. That's how we won the American Revolution. We didn't have 50% plus one of the American population on board with uh, this plan to, uh, extricate ourselves from the Brits.

It actually went in that pattern of 0.5%, 3%, and then 15% in that case. And that, that was enough. It's the same with technology companies. It's the same with the adoption of ideas. And there's a quote that I really love. And I think it maps really well to this crossing the chasm concept. It's from a guy by the When an audience is presented with a theory that's one level above they find it inspiring. their understanding, When the information is two levels above their comprehension, they fall asleep. At three levels, they become angry. And when the data reaches four levels above the level of the audience, they want to kill the presenter. And I actually think that maps to these in a way to

these different stages. So if you're going to the people that are normally the laggards, that are the last people to generally adopt something, they're going to react with anger and violence. So we just need to focus, just understand, we don't need everybody to buy in right now. We just need to find our 2.5% or half a percent. And as long as we keep that perspective, I think that this is completely doable. I'm not pessimistic about it at all. It's just a matter of focus and keeping this in mind. And so with that, I will say go to daylightfreedom.org where you can check out with all these events, Everything that's going on check out these workshops. These workshops are hugely

important because not only I'm talking about CBDCs, but I'm adding this great taking as well. So I'm going to show people how to tokenize assets. So when you go through this, you're going to end up with crypto. You're going to have a wallet with crypto. You're going to end up with gold, maybe silver. It depends on the context. have privacy tokens. But you're also going to And you're going to walk out there knowing, out of this event, knowing how to live on these assets. and knowing how to begin tokenizing and trading assets. So I think this is really powerful stuff. I'm looking for that. And I think we can do it. I'm trying to recruit the 0.5%. I mean, and by the way,

who's the target audience for this? People ask me this all the time as well. It's actually not even the people that are already in crypto so much as the people that have been radicalized from COVID tyranny. If you look at those 17 sustainable development goals of the UN, find people that would be against those, Find the people that don't right? like carbon credits, find the people that are opposed to 15 minute cities, find health freedom people, find food freedom people. there are tens of millions of I mean, people that once they understand that once money becomes programmable and centrally controlled, their ability to exercise free will and advocate for themselves on their issue goes away.

And so this is the critical thing that we need to deal with. So with that, it's about an hour, which is about where I thought I'd be. I'm going to add... I had some folks to the discussion. And by the way, you're also free to ask questions. I want to make this informative. I don't know if what I said is understandable or not. So part of this for me is I'm really looking forward to any feedback that you can provide. So with that, I'm happy to be joined by Steve Thurmond. I am for I am. direct from Philly who I think is, is muted, but, uh, direct from Philly is George. George has been a great friend of mine for almost three decades and we've worked together on a whole variety of things.

So I'm really excited to have everybody on here. Well, I guess I'll go first. Um, first I commend you on a fantastic article, uh, Aaron, I thought it was, uh, well-written, uh, concise with, with a lot of information and, and, um, I've been following your work and CBDCs for a little while now. And the question that came to mind when I was reading it, and I kind of noted it down here is, I wasn't aware of that Disney meme that you showed as you're going over your article, but it kind of made me think of like a mesh network.

These corporations have shared ownership And we're we're signing away all of these, you know, signing our life away. Like they said, the example of of a test of signing away your first born with all these digital agreements. But it made me think of like a mesh network. Can you imagine If these were all tied together and a legal precedent is set that with this Disney case, that because they signed on with Disney+, it actually, you know, it's pretty worrisome that it expanded beyond just Disney+, but their subsidiaries.

So what's your comments on that? so I wrote the article and then I saw Well, that meme because and I'm like, wow. So I had I wasn't aware of the case before. And it just it says you're right. It's horrifying because we don't read these things and we have no idea what kind of spillover is in these or or even when you're signing with somebody. How are you even to know if you're buying something? XYZ consumer product, that that product is part of a conglomerate that owns 80 other companies that you're not aware of. And somehow you are vicariously signing away your rights to those companies. There's no way to even know that. And so that is certainly something that they could do.

I have enough friends that have been Look, thrown in. being a freestater here in New Hampshire, You know, the only two times I see my friends are at events like Porkfest and Liberty Forum or in court hearings. So I've certainly seen a lot of absolute crazy things. And I... One of the things that we should now be doing with AI is everybody should now be just taking their agreements that they've signed and running them through AIs and doing summaries and sharing the summaries and taking the contractual information and putting it into formats like that meme so that people don't have to read the hour a day worth of stuff. But let's start highlighting because I did that with

banks and I'm like, wow, They can cancel our account. They can change the terms on us. They can change fees and they can sell and give away our data. So that's already the case with banks. But is it any different with anything else? Probably not. It doesn't seem like it. But who knows? I don't know. Do I read? I don't read the agreements either. Like I'm not sitting here saying, oh, You know, great. all of you out there not reading these agreements. Nobody does. I don't read them either. And in fact, I had I had a company. My last company, I was selling to HR and the sales cycle was like 18 months. And so I was like, all right, well, let's make it a click wrap agreement.

And we and we closed our sales cycle from 18 months to six months and then avoided having to deal with legal. It was actually a brilliant move in terms of like for my own business, because the minute it's like, oh, I'm sending over a Word document and it's 40 pages long and then it's like, OK, we'll see in a year. Um, so, uh, I, so I, I suspect once everybody, if we just need to like generate mass outrage of, of all of these things and looking at all of these agreements, I think on Pinterest where I saw something, they were actually showing the printouts, they were like trying to, they, they printed out the agreement and then showed the relative length of the contracts for various, uh,

organizations stuff like that just things to get people outraged so that so that we start talking about this but then again to think about it again this isn't trivial things that we do this with we've done it with our stocks and our bonds and with our more how many people read their mortgage how many people read the agreement when they lease a car or or buy a car I mean almost no one so right these quick quick wrap agreements include you know like the bail-in with the banks a bail-in um we just I think we all now have we can't escape that that um they can use our funds to bail themselves out absolutely and that I mean that is a that is that's built into some of the

designs for CBDCs. Bail-ins are a big part of this, and I know the EU's already been drafting language away on that. Great article, Aaron. One of many. I just got to say, if those listening haven't checked out some of Aaron's work, read his book. Always a wealth of information. You know, this theme of since the dawn of time, there's always been bullies that want to control the tribe. We're just seeing this now on systemic levels. I guess those that control the flow of money, when money really has no meaning anymore, their lust for power and control is their motivation.

And that's what I keep seeing here in the theme of all of these things taking place as far as, again, controlling the flow of money. They want control at the end of the day. I'd like to, if you could, elaborate a little bit more on the tokenization aspect. This is something that's very intriguing to me. I know you're a big advocate of XANA. We've talked about it a few times. I've talked about it with a few other people, and I guess I get the impression from others that they say there's nothing really special about tokenization. I want to kind of push back against that,

but I don't know how to properly do so. So my first question here is if we're using these various cryptocurrencies as a medium of exchange, what is the necessary or the necessity for tokenization of a physical asset when you already have a cryptocurrency as a medium of exchange? What is the necessity to tokenize anything when I can just trade Monero or Bitcoin Cash or Litecoin with you for said asset? If you could answer that first, then I'll follow up with another. Well, so so tokenizing the asset doesn't mean that you're not using money. I mean, we have a centralized database now where you move your title for your house, your title for your car. You're still using money as

the medium of exchange. But the actual record and the tracking of the asset itself and the rights around that is stored in a database. That's why I wrote the article, which was to answer the very question that you said, why is tokenization important? Well, once people are probably not thinking about the fact that everything runs through a centralized database. That's the part of this that people don't understand today. Everything is being recorded in these databases. And as I said, ten and a half trillion dollars of loss for these databases, because if you lose your rights, if your ownership isn't in that database or that database gets hacked, you own your asset. legally. Right.

So you still need a digital currency to trade. Now, I'm saying you could actually and I'm not advocating for this, but if you had to, you could actually implement a barter system where people could actually trade assets directly or swap assets. I've actually done that in Zeno just to play around with. I could actually trade two It's like, OK, pigs for one cow without a third party using Zeno. I'm not suggesting that that's the way the economy should work, but I'm saying that that isn't that's one other thing that you could do with it. But this is just a matter of saying not allowing them to use these either centralized databases or centralized systems for tokenizing assets to have

them in in our private self custody so that we can trade with people and the rights to those assets remain under the ownership of the person that actually owns them. And then to whoever they're selling, that is all also tokenized and they can then subsequently sell it or do whatever they need to do with it. But it's outside of these centralized systems. It's outside of the current centralized systems. And one thing I'm going to do, these 50 categories of assets, just like I described money, right? I'm going to go through Money is an Oracle database here. And it's a bunch of these Microsoft and Oracle databases here. I'm going to go through each one of these 50 markets and do a one or two page

summary that explains how each of these markets work. who's controlling the database, who the middlemen are, who the regulators are, consequences are when you and then what the take that centralized database and tokenize it in a centralized way. Because I hear you. This is what prompted me to write this article is that, yeah, when you talk to people in crypto, they're like, oh, I think of tokenization as NFTs and meme coins. And so it's like, well, these have no use. I don't need this. And part of the problem is that's been a problem with the crypto community. While we're doing hot dog meme coins on Solano, they're literally building the system to put all of our stocks and bonds and

our mortgages and everything on a centralized platform. So part of this is the educational process of saying, guys, Everything is going to be tokenized, whether you like it or not. And the default, unless we do something like Zeno or come up with an alternative, the default is regulated liability network. and CBDCs. And I have yet to, I've been to 22 States. I've done 50 different interviews and multiple interviews with through those different people. And I have yet to find anybody that had heard of regulated liability network before. And a lot of these are people that are in the crypto space. So like this stuff has been flying under the radar. That's why I wanted to put

So it's like, Oh wait, they're doing that. that in the article. Oh, the federal reserve of New York, the bank for international settlements and MIT, they they're working on that. Because a lot of people have this conception, and I've argued with people even on the CBDC front. They're like, oh, government's incompetent. They'll never be able to pull off a CBDC. And it's like the government isn't building the CBDC. It is the most well-financed banks in the world funding the best technical talent. And I want to add one other thing about this. So the U.S. CBDC, this retail CBDC pilot between MIT and the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, one of their developers on the white papers a guy

named corey fields who was a bitcoin core developer who worked on lightning network and who worked on um segwit now regulated liability network the platform itself that regulated liability network is built on was developed by and the chief platform officer is mike hearn one of the very early Bitcoin developers, who, by the way, was a big blocker and was one of the five founders of the Bitcoin Foundation, along with Roger Ver and Gavin Andreessen and others. So when you look at what we're dealing with here, and I say this just to say, they have the best people working on this. I mean, we know Bitcoin was hijacked. So what happened to the good developers?

The good developers are working on this centralized dystopian thing that we don't want. so because again it's important I have a lot of people that are apathetic don't think it can be built about this because they or somehow they're resting on their laurels or feel like somehow um you know they're technologically advanced we're no longer technologically advanced gold has out innovated btc this is a better medium of a change than btc it wasn't in 2012 it is now and they are spending massive amounts of money working on this stuff. So it's hard to talk about because I think the frustration that I've had within the crypto community is that there's a sense within crypto that we're

just battling ourselves, that it's a foregone conclusion that crypto is one and that we've defeated all of the central, but you know, it's just, they accept it as already done. And so now it's just a battle amongst cryptos. And I'm like the entire sector, 0.4% use crypto, all cryptos to buy and sell things. Like we're getting crushed and people aren't even aware of it. So anyway, I hope that helps. And I'm going to, and I am going to break this up even more. And because I know a lot of this is abstract, so I'm going to get granular. I'm going to be like, this is how the baseball card market works. Here's how, you know, here's Beckett's and here's And here are the databases how grading works.

for baseball cards. So if you could, if you could just kind of expound on that, I want you, if you can, for myself and your listeners included, use a scenario and explain it like I'm a Labrador retriever, So you're taking a physical asset, if you would. you're tokenizing it. How do you utilize that without some form of trust? one of the big aspects of You know, cryptocurrency is it's trustless at the end of the day. So how are you doing this, actually exchanging physical assets without a third party escrow trust or centralized authority to middleman that transaction if you are actually trading

physical things that have been tokenized? If you can actually break that down as easy as possible. Well, and so part of this is, and again, when I say this, you know, so Zeno is early in releasing a lot of these features. In fact, I got involved in it right as they, when I got involved and downloaded the wallet, you couldn't even create tokens yet in the wallet. Like now they've been working on it for five years, but they're just now at the like user-friendly part. To your point, one of the things that they're building into the system, they actually had built it and then they upgraded the underlying blockchain. And now they're having to kind of reconfigure things is, There's an escrow system

built in that doesn't require third parties. It's native to the platform itself. So there are no smart contracts, but there is an escrow system built on mutually assured destruction. So I've actually tokenized and sold a gold back. And I will be able to in the future, if it's with somebody I don't know, we can agree that they bought this. We both put an amount in escrow. I send it to them or don't send it to them, as the case may be. And either we work it out and we finalize the transaction and the funds are released from escrow or they aren't. But it's that model. It's a mutually assured destruction-based model with a built-in system that requires no third parties.

And you said it's not a smart contract? It's not a smart contract or maybe a different way to look at it. So it's kind of like the way I look at it is it's kind of like With Ravencoin. With Ravencoin, you create tokens, but it's integrated into the platform. So you're not creating a special smart contract. It's actually native to the protocol itself. And they're building that into Zeno as well. So you're not actually writing a smart contract. But I guess one different way to look at it is there's been a smart contract that's been developed and integrated directly into the protocol itself. That's probably a more... more accurate way of describing it. And again,

understand that when I am looking at this, I'm looking, here's my view of the world. Because a lot of people will say, well, I'm interested in DeFi, I'm interested in all this other stuff. The point of Bitcoin was to be peer-to-peer digital cash for the world. We're 15 years in, we do not have peer-to-peer digital cash for the world. I look at DeFi as being like a video game franchise. It's basically something a bunch of people that are playing around with, it's like a video game in a way. But when the underlying thing, only 0.4% of people are actually using it, the underlying main base case, we have to go back and focus on basics. We need money. We need people to have money

that they can use as an alternative to CBDCs. And we need to be able to do basic trade. And the reason I'm bringing this up is a lot of people say to me, oh, I'm interested in this. I'm interested in how we can do all of these different DeFi related things. And I'm like, we really don't know how to walk. We're building second layer solutions on top of first layer solutions that don't work and that nobody uses. And there's almost like a whole bunch of effort being spent on that and no effort being One of the other things that they're building into this is you can have in Zeno what are called aliases. So my alias is at Aaron. in Zeno. So you can use the Zeno wallet and you can send me

tokens or you can send me Zeno. You don't have to remember my wallet address or anything else. And again, those transactions, nobody can see. So even though I told you I'm Aaron, you could send me something and nobody's going to be able to figure that out, even though you know what my thing is. They're building, and this is part of the magic that I don't know how it works, but they're in based on these aliases. Now, I don't fully know how that works, but it's phenomenal to think about. Imagine being able to actually build a reputation management into a system that is at the same time private and offers confidential assets and confidential transactions. That's wild. And for those that aren't

familiar with this, The main dev behind Zeno actually worked on the crypto note technology, which is the technology that Monero is built on. Like the tech behind this is actually fascinating. And for me, when I first looked at it, I'm like, oh, I didn't like the fact that it was proof of it's a proof of work, proof of stake hybrid. So I originally was like, I'm not going to look at this. And then actually, Roger Ver is like, you really should look at this. And I'm like, OK, I guess I'll give it a second look. And then I read the white paper and then I read all the documentations. And I'm like, the number of innovations in this thing is incredible. is immense. And I don't want to bore

everybody with details, but one of the problems with proof of stake is there are multiple problems. One, it can be, as in the case of Ethereum, it's like an oligarchy where all of the control is centralized. And one of the other problems is that you can identify, because it's an open system, who has what coins. So state actors or others could actually come in and influence the situation. They've actually built this hybrid proof of work, proof of stake model where the identity remains private of who's actually, and they're not even nodes. The actual distribution is probabilistic. It's not even based on the same system that Ethereum works. So I'm saying all that to say,

do I know everything about it? No, I've spent a lot of time on it. I'm continuing to spend time on it and I'm continuing to learn. I'm continuing to experiment. But my interest is fundamentally knowing the importance of tokenization and at least knowing based on what it claims to do and what I've tested it that it does, it is a solution to the great taking and it is a solution to this whole non-monetary asset tokenization that is going on. That is like 95% of everything. And so I'm gonna continue to, like I said, I will try to make it simple and I wanna make it simple industry by industry because I wanna get people thinking about, oh, wait a minute, this industry works like this.

We could disrupt. I want people to start thinking about all the different ways we can disrupt all of these industries that have all these middlemen that are running on these centralized databases. I mean, it'll blow people's minds away, myself, because obviously I haven't analyzed all 50 of these markets, but like just this exercise that I've been doing on the dollar itself, I didn't realize until like last week that the Federal Reserve runs on an Oracle database. And then I was actually studying the history of the Fed wire system. And now they have Fed now, but they went through three. So I could actually make the statement, and I think it's accurate. We've had a central bank

digital currency since 1998. But you go back before that and they're using tapes. It's interesting to reverse engineer the evolution of individual markets and to look at how we went from a pre-database situation to databases and then the evolution even of these centralized databases to working with the cloud. And then you dig into this and it's like, yeah, no, it's much more profound than I think we think. what you can do with this blockchain technology, what it's really disrupting. It's disrupting a lot more than we can imagine. And it has to. It's up to us. I say this all the time. Nobody is coming to save us. It's up to us to bolster this parallel economy and

create this parallel economy. Unfortunately, I'm at a point where I think it's going to take a crisis before people actually do anything. It seems to be the nature of things. People call the masses sheep. I think we're actually comfortable wolves at the end of the day. As the saying goes, there's a lack of nine meals to anarchy. And when the people get uncomfortable enough, the teeth come out. But I think it's going to take something to actually make that happen. It's going to take a crisis, unfortunately. I mean, if COVID didn't shake people out of their boots. I mean, it did a lot of people. I think a lot of people woke up during that. But a lot of people also

just went along to get along as well. It was really disheartening to see. So I don't know what it takes at this point. But the reality is, is nobody's coming to save us. And we have to do anything we can to bolster this parallel economy. It's up to us to build it and make it happen. And again, going back to the example of crossing the chasm, we need to get together the 0.5%. And by the way, they've done a great job of dividing and conquering. Think about this. They took Bitcoin and then fragmented it into 20,000 pieces. Well, how are you going to cross the chasm? How are you going to go from 2.5% to 13.5% when you've been shattered into 20,000 pieces? What a great job they did.

And they did it intentionally. The hijacking of Bitcoin, the more I dig into it, and Roger does a great job up until 2017, the stuff that's happened after 2017 is much worse than what even happened then. And now what are we doing? Now we have people proposing to use the product of theft through civil asset forfeiture to start a Bitcoin strategic reserve. How is this going to work in the future? You get pulled over for a traffic stop and they seize your wallet? to do it for the good of the nation, for the good of the Bitcoin Strategic Reserve. And then with $35 trillion in debt, they're going to steal from our children. Yeah, the forfeiture laws, you know, you get pulled over by a

police officer and you're on your way to go buy a car or something. You got $5,000 cash and they got to show the receipts and they confiscate it and it's difficult to get. They could do the same thing with wallets. Aaron, I have a question about BTC when you're ready. Yeah, one second. I see Litecoin Lisa on there. Lisa, I want to... I've used WhiteCoin a little bit. I'm not as integrated into the community. I think we all need to work together. This is why I'm going to the Monero thing. I think we should all work together, because I know there's a lot of infighting, but it's like, we've all got to work together to come up with solutions. Because here's the one thing that I will tell you,

and I roasted the CEO of Circle that makes USDC last week. when he announced this touch to pay thing with Apple. So you're now gonna be able to use Apple to do touch to pay with a stable coin. And he's like making these claims like this is like the pinnacle of cryptocurrency. The point of cryptocurrency was peer to peer digital cash. And when you look at what a stable coin is, there are so many intermediaries there. It's such a disappointment. But here's the one thing that I will say, if we can't figure out how to have a touch to pay solution that is low cost and scales, we now have to beat that from an implementation perspective. And if we don't, that's on us. Now,

the government trying to shut us down and all that other stuff, yeah, that's an unfortunate headwind that we have to deal with. But what we haven't done is we haven't built a solution and we got to work together on that as quickly as possible. And that's what I hope to be able to do talking to these different communities is maybe, and as I articulate this, hopefully people are like, oh yeah, 1.8 million transactions per second if my coin does 40 or 50 transactions per second and we know they're going to roll out cbdc's in an emergency here's what I worry about and steve to your point It'll take an emergency. Yes, it will take an emergency. But what do we have to do is the 0.5%.

We have to build a solution. So when that emergency happens, they have a choice because we know there will be an emergency. We know there'll be in a state of fear. The only thing that we can do is offer that choice. But to offer a choice, knowing that what they're building is 1.8 million transactions per second and everything else is a multi-asset solution out of necessity right now. We can fight later after we defeat the technocracy tyrants. But for right now, we've got to figure out how to make it so that grandma can use this. And there's just a lot of arrogance. There's almost a, oh, it's great to be elite. I know how to use a lightning node and people scoffing at other people

for being stupid. And it's just money. I wish we had the same passion about money. wouldn't it be cool if we could help, you know, a grandma or people that have no technical ability, be able to have freedom money and had the passion about the use and, and liberating people that we do about, you know, being special about being able to use software that's complicated. So George. Yeah. So, uh, Bitcoin, BTC, let me be clear, BTC's current adoption is through ETFs. Where would you put that in the crossing the chasm cycle? I don't even put it in the... It's not even in the

crossing the chasm framework. It's a PSYOP intended to divert... people's resources and attention from something that can be used as an alternative currency. In fact, by the way, think about this. So the great taking is what? The great taking is all these legal contracts that in the event of a bankruptcy, the banks end up owning everything. Well, what is the BlackRock ETF? It's all wound up in that too. So when the great taking happens, everybody that owns a BlackRock Bitcoin ETF, all of their Bitcoin is going to end up in the hands of JP Morgan Chase, Bank of America, Wells Fargo, and Citibank. So I don't have it. It's not in the crossing the chasm. I have it in the psyop

diverting everybody else from being able. I guess it's a it's a inhibitor of crossing the chasm for everybody else. That's what its role is, in my opinion. So originally, based on the white paper, Bitcoin was supposed to be capped at 21 million coins, very similar to the Brenton Woods agreement that tied an ounce of gold to thirty five dollars. So do you think CBDCs will ever pretend to cap the supply of the new digital currency, the new digital fiat? Not a chance. Not a chance. The entire goal is to keep things status quo and keep printing, now doing it completely digitally with total and

complete tyrannical control. That's the end goal. There's no way. If there is a way to loot, they will loot every fucking time. Period. That's it at the end of the day. I couldn't agree with you more, Steve, and I would add to it that Even if they introduce the CBDC, the total supply will be hidden from us. Or it will be, you know, said that, oh, there's, you know, you know, 14 trillion and that's it. When in fact, it could be 30 and there'll be no way of telling the difference. They've already changed how the M1, M2, M3 money supplies are presented now in reporting. And M3 has been eliminated.

They're addicted to cheap money. They're addicted to cheap money and fractional reserve banking. They're addicted to it. And there's no way of stopping it unless we just make it irrelevant, which is why we have to create our own economy at the end of the day. And I haven't even seen anybody propose that. None of the CBDC pilots have had as a selling point or attribute, hey, we're fixing the supply. I haven't even seen that as a talking, they don't even care. But the problem, you know, but the real problem is, and it's like Henry Ford had that comment, if people understood how the financial system works, they'd riot in the streets the next morning. And that's absolutely true.

People don't know how this works. That's part of why I wrote the article and the subsequent article that I'm writing to explain how the mechanics of money works with these databases. Because I didn't even know, I mean, you know, whether it was an Oracle, I knew it was a database, but actually when I got, I was so laughable to see the history of how this has gotten to where it is. And I will do a separate podcast after I do an article. on the political stuff, but, but I do want to highlight the fact that, you know, right now, this is all just a manufactured polarity contest, the Republicans versus the Democrats. Again, you either get programmable money through the central bank or

through the commercial banks. That's a difference without a distinction or distinction without a difference, however the, however the phrase goes. And so, but yet here we are all riled up about it. I I'm watching all these people fight about which side is better for crypto. And I'm like, I want everybody to read or have AI summarize the Loomis Gillibrand bill, because the one thing that's horrifying that's going on right now is they might actually pass something before the election. And I have looked through every single one of these bills that's been drafted. None of them are pro privacy. None of them are net pro consumer. They all enhance KYC AML. They all give more control to,

to the banks, and they give more control to third parties. In particular, the Loomis-Gillibrand bill, and remember, Cynthia Loomis is the one who went to the Bitcoin Nashville conference, proposed the strategic reserve to buy one Bitcoin. Her bill bans algorithmic stablecoins explicitly. Her bill would put the power to issue stablecoins in the hands of banks and ultimately in the hands of the largest banks. She has made explicit statements against privacy. So when you understand that, when Trump says he's going to pass something in 100 days or when Chuck Schumer comes out and says, we're going to try to pass a piece of legislation in the Senate this session, The baseline bill is the

Loomis-Gillibrand bill. Gillibrand is a Democrat from New York. The best case scenario we have is the Loomis-Gillibrand bill. That's where they'll start and they'll make it worse from there. So everybody who thinks that they're playing politics and, oh, we have power and, oh, we've arrived, they're listening to us, understand and read the bills. We're getting played. And we are all going to suffer for it. It's not too far before your crypto has to be whitelisted or it actually will have to be whitelisted. It's not even a matter of it being on a blacklist. You will have to register it to be whitelisted. And privacy coins will be banned and everything will I mean, go through banks.

I wrote a little satirical thing about they'll redefine it and they'll say that self-custody means having a crypto wallet through a bank. You get to have your own crypto wallet through a bank, and that'll be called, and they'll rebrand that self-custody. And as much as that's a joke and meant to be satirical, watch. I wouldn't be surprised. Can you real briefly expand a little bit on the, what is it, the regulated liability? Liability networks, RLNs, who are they? How are they funded? How far do they, I'm sure they cross the pond, like, you know, into Europe. I think you mentioned even the International Banks of Settlement are involved in the RLN,

because that sure seems like their mechanic, the mechanics behind the Great Takening. It does, and this is why they gave it such a boring name, right? Actually, I read the white paper the first time, and it almost put me to sleep. It is so filled with buzzwords and BS. But when you go through it, if you think about it, so what is – a regulated liability, a CBDC. I mean, it's a tokenized liability. That's what it is, right? It's an IOU from the government. That's what is tokenized. And so they're literally doing that. So that's why, by the way,

hidden in that name is the idea that if people think that there are going to be CBDCs backed by precious metals, Read the regulated liability network. The entire purpose of it, and when you read it, is to continue the system of having tokenized liabilities. It is still the same liability system. They are trying to preserve fiat, the fiat system as it is. on a global scale. The people behind it are the Federal Reserve Bank of New York. That's the primary funder. MIT has been involved in all three US CBDCs. The head of funding that initially was Joy Ito,

who was the disgraced head of the MIT Media Lab, who took funding from Jeffrey Epstein, and who also started a venture capital firm called the Digital Garage. So in addition to the stuff that he was doing at MIT with CBDCs, he also funded privately Segwit Lightning Network and a whole bunch of other. He's an investor in Blockstream. So when you go through this, you almost want to stop researching it because it's like, okay, no one's going to believe that if I say that. And then it's like, do I really want to know what the next rung is? So it's MIT, Federal Reserve Bank of New York, Bank of Mellon. I can't even remember which ones it are, but five huge banks out of New York.

The Bank for International Settlements, but it's using this platform. That was developed by Mike Hearn. So Mike Hearn is literally the chief platform officer. That is his title. Now, I've got to tell you, I've just learned about that recently. I already knew about Corey But this guy, Fields on the other side. I actually thought he was a good guy. he was the guy he was like he You know, rage quit Bitcoin because they didn't move forward on big blocks. He was one of the ones pushing Bitcoin. one of the early Bitcoin forks to expand the block size. And so I didn't realize until very recently that he literally is the chief platform officer. So whatever is being architected, he's smart.

I mean, the one thing I will say about him, he's smart. He's very capable. And so the technical talent is good. The funding is good. And the intent is bad, right? Like the, you know, the intent is to keep the fiat system in place to, and the language in the document, read the white, the white paper says that, that crypto is a threat and that they have to build a common platform that protects the existing central bank system. They say it in there. And in fact, I'll probably create some memes. I'll pull some of the quotes because it has this guy from this bank making a comment about regulated liability, this other person making this comment. And you're right. There are different

regulated liability networks being developed in the UK and in other places. And so I haven't actually gone down the rabbit hole of who's working on it in the UK. Is it Barclays bank? And is it this? I haven't, I haven't even gone. I'm kind of like, I don't need to know anymore, but I will eventually go and dig into that as well, because I think it is increasingly important that people understand the tokenization of these other assets. And we are so close to this. Um, I'll probably do an event with David Rogers Webb. I'm glad I'm speaking at Chris Martinson's event, Peak Prosperity event, because Chris has really been taking the lead on, I mean, he really raised the

awareness of this issue with me. And he's been on the forefront of this. there are political efforts And by the way, at the state level to unwind this UCC legislation. And they were close in South Dakota. And I guess the amount of pressure that the banks put on that, like they were this close to the finish line. And I guess the banks just terrified. I don't know who it was, the president of the Senate or the speaker of the house. Like, like this is, this is a serious issue that no one was supposed to find out about. It was supposed to be one of those, you know, if, if, if we're going to sign an agreement that says we're firstborn and all of our data to the NSA, going to give away our

what do you think is buried in 20 000 pages deep in a piece of banking legislation that was passed in 1994 at the state level right nobody read any of that nobody most of the people that vote almost everybody voted on it didn't read it so um I'll dig more into regulated liability network as we as we go along quick another quick question is um you know there are some states that are trying to propose laws or have already been signed into our bills and and signed into law that you know They're not going to, you know, trying to ban CBDCs within their state. And I just don't buy it because I think what COVID taught us was,

the big corporations are going to pierce that veil, if you will. Amazon is going to accept the CBDC or require you to use the CBDC or provide you a hefty discount if you use a CBDC, despite your state making it illegal. And I think that's kind of a moot point for a state to try to pass any kind of legislation to stop CBDCs. I don't think they are capable of doing that. So my thoughts on this, and this is why I'm doing this next article. My actual thoughts at this point in time are that we've had a CBDC since 1998. That's my first thought. My first thought is, and like Florida passed a bill and it's like, well, yeah, we're not going to have a CBDC where, you know,

our transactions can be monitored. Like, okay, are you going to unwind the fact that they're doing it now with the existing system? Like, like it's, it's actually absurd. And I could go through the laws that are being used in the collection techniques. We're already being surveilled. The only difference between us and China is China has a better, better product for consumers. We don't get any of the benefits of having a central bank digital currency. We get the surveillance and, And we get everything else. And so, yeah, I look at those bills the same way. So again, if you make it so that the tokenization is happening at the level of the bank and not the central bank, who cares?

From our perspective, what difference does that make? And here's another thing. The enemy on this isn't from the perspective of having our money shut off and everything else. It's not the central bank. It's the government. It's not the government. It's not the central bank that is, or even the banks that are going around proactively shutting people off or implementing all of the reporting or doing all the KYC. It's the government that's doing it. It's a combination of Congress. And by the way, Cynthia Loomis, just read all of her language about terrorism and money laundering and all and how horrible it is with crypto and with stable coins, right? So she's the big Republican front on this.

And so she's pushing that narrative. It's not like the banks are going necessarily out of their way to, I mean, not that they're great. they certainly have horrific practices, but all of the real harm is being done by the government through the banks. So whether the government is doing the harm through banks the commercial banks who own the Federal Reserve or whether they're going through the central bank, I just don't see how it matters. I guess there's a question of I mean, centralization. So right now it's not centralized. You have the Federal Reserve has a ledger and then everybody else has the ledger and they integrate. So you could make the argument that it would be

easier mechanically to program things and to centrally control things, but they can still do it now through the banks. This is why to me, it's a distinction without a difference. And I actually want to, go through and showcase this. Florida put out this central bank digital legislation law and it was a change in the UCC code. And here's the problem with that. The problem with the changes in the UCC code is what it does is it strips the consumer of consumer protection. So money has a very specific set of meanings under the UCC code. And basically, whereas crypto doesn't, Bitcoin does not have the right? protection that money would have from a contractual perspective that money has.

And so basically what they've done is they've said at the state level, okay, well, if you implement a CBDC, the consumers won't have protection. what do you think is going to Well, actually happen in an roll out CBDCs? emergency when they try to They'll roll it out, and then what? Now all of your voters are going to be exposed? What do you think the net effect is going to be? Oh, well, we better – oh, we didn't know that. We better go fix the UCC code. So the other thing is they can always, and they have in the past, overridden UCC code stuff on a national basis in an emergency. So this is why – And I've spent some time on this because I'm involved with the Citizens for Sound Money,

which is pushing gold and silver at the state level. But what I say is the only reason to do that is because it might help the adoption of alternatives from the perspective of it gives people more confidence. But you don't need it because you could pass a law making gold and silver a legal tender. But if people aren't using goldbacks and if merchants aren't accepting them and you don't have an infrastructure in place, it's a useless law. You need people actually using these things. Now, having the law might make people more willing to use it, but it's it's it's not a necessary. It's a nice to have, but not a necessary to have. The necessary thing is actually developing the

technology and using the technology. And then actually, as you're doing that, then that actually gives you more ability to persuade the lawmakers, because otherwise right now you're trying to sell an abstraction. to politicians where they're looking at okay you're conceptually saying I should have I i should do this with cbdc's it's complicated my voters don't know what it is I should make gold and silver legal tender while none of my none of my voters are asking for it so why should I care am I going to stick stick my neck out to do this and so so I'm kind of like I'll spend time working on the state regulatory stuff to the extent it can help with the adoption. But not if there's any

amount of time where I'm like, I'm actually wasting time working on adoption, then I won't do it. One more quick question, comment and get your opinion, Aaron is, and I'd like to hear Steve's comment on this as well is, If the government comes down to the point where they're going to start trying to ban, say, privacy coins like Monero or Zano, and let's say they go even a step further and make it illegal even for, say, BCH or Litecoin because they have privacy functionality as an option. At what point will the normies be willing to cross over for civil disobedience

and still transact in these? Because I feel that they still couldn't stop them, but it'll make it even difficult from a point of sale to try to get merchants to adopt it. What we really need is more of a like kind of a peaceful cannabis viewpoint where the federal government still views cannabis use as illegal. But states have approved it and legalized it in various forms, either recreational or only for you know, medicinal purposes. So what do you think could happen? And how do we elevate the normies into a belief of civil disobedience is okay with Monero use or Zano or Litecoin, BCH,

Zcash, whichever? Well, I still say the fundamental issue that doesn't go away is that if we have to make this stuff easy to use or we're going to have a hard time with normies or with adoption in general. But if we do that, if we do solve that, then to your point, if you look at what's going on right now, again, this is why I say from a Who are the two and a half percent we're targeting? We should target people that are already dealing with food freedom issues, where they already know health freedom issues, their industry is in jeopardy, where they already know or they have already had their financial transactions censored and their access to banking services removed. So that is our,

so we have an easy to use solution. We have a ready audience and those people will fight because they're fighting now. Those are people that are already, that's who we need. That's our two and a half percent. And if those two and a half percent are engaged, those are already fighters anyway. Those are people that are already pissed off. These are people that are already aware that the government is going to go after them and try to shut down what they're doing. And it's on fundamental things like injecting poison in your body or whether you can eat healthy food. So these are the frontline people. But when you talk to them, a lot of them aren't in crypto and a lot of them

aren't necessarily technically savvy. So that's where we can come in. But if we get those people on our side, if that's our army, if that's our two and a half percent, then when they go to push the thing in an emergency, then people are going to be pissed and we're going to have a whole group. It's not just us that's going to be talking about this. We're going to have a whole bunch of influencers that can speak in their language And that's where this thing to their group. goes mainstream. But it's a race against time because until we get our act together on the product side, it's going to be... difficult because we're going to be spending a lot of time doing technical support,

trying to explain to people complicated things as how to use these opposed to scaling up the adoption of something that's easy to use. So, but that's what I think. But if you look at these things, look at how bad this is going to get. I actually am proposing one of the things that I want to talk about at Mineratopia, about this with Litecoin but I actually want to talk and with Bitcoin Cash and everything else. And if you see me post about this, I'm doing an article because what I've my entire life, I've been a pro liberty guy. Like I wasn't you know, I've been radicalized multiple times and it goes time I get radicalized. to different levels every But I kind of started out a

liberty guy and ran club in college. And, you know, so it's like I mean, excuse me, in high school. But I've always assumed privacy is a right. And then I just assumed that other people assumed privacy was a right. But now I question that because when I see that this Cato thing where a third of Gen Z are okay with a government camera in the home to monitor for domestic violence, when I read some of the stuff that's going on and then I'm digging into this. And so I've been going through this exercise of saying, okay, what's the philosophical moral and legal basis for privacy and then who is on the side of transparency and against privacy. This is going to take me a while to research because I

want to really understand this. But the reason that I'm doing this is I think that we all have to work together to market and sell privacy. We have been pigeonholed when people talk about Monero or they talk about privacy coins, what is it immediately? You're a drug dealer, you're a terrorist, you're doing something evil. It was George W. Bush when he spoke at a press conference about the NSA. If you've got nothing to hide, you have nothing to worry about, right? Because again, I'm going back, I'm like, who's the ideological force? Behind that, for George Bush to be sitting there making that statement, how do we go from the Constitution and natural rights and the whole

founding of the Constitution, Bush making a statement like that? how do we get to George Who's pushing that other narrative? And I'm starting to learn. I mean, of course, it's the technocrats and the totalitarian side of things. It's Karl Marx. It's great. It is the technocrats. But some of these people have even influenced MIT. There's and I'm not MIT, the libertarian circles and Cato. And I'm beginning to now find my eyes are being opened to who's pushing this. There's a movement that says that there are some people that said even Plato said that, you know, the government should be transparent. And he didn't speak about the people. There are several people, Bentham who did,

Utilitarianism said the government should be transparent, but wasn't really clear about the people There's a movement now that just says everything should be transparent and if everybody was transparent everything would work out Which is a naive view, but it's a view that's actually infecting libertarian circles And so this is why it's like I encountered this. This is the thing that I encountered with the BSV community I'm like, are you guys serious? I even argued with Craig Wright about this you actually think that A central bank, these people will fund both sides of war. They're perfectly fine with genocide. I mean, they really don't care what the human cost is of this.

You think they're going to voluntarily accept a permissionless open system that provides transparency? Have you studied any of the history of banking and central banking and war? And so I don't have a full both sides and I'm really answer because I'm studying trying to understand how we got to where we are. But the short of it is, Gen Z doesn't value privacy. It is not something that is a core principle. So what do we need to do as a community to change this dynamic from we're automatically engaging in criminal activity to one, this is morally, this is a right, but then practically to say, this isn't about whether I'm selling drugs now, this is about whether I'm able to buy red meat tomorrow,

whether I'm able to drive my car more than 50 miles in a week, the week after that, whether I'm allowed to buy raw milk, whether I'm allowed to reject a medical treatment. This is something everybody should be concerned about, but we have to market it. And we have to market it not as an edgy dark market thing, because the new dark market, today's regular market is tomorrow's dark market. And the sooner we can articulate that and get people on our side, we need to change the dynamic. We need to make privacy cool, but I mean, also fundamental. And I think we're gonna have to break out of where we're kind of in a, well, this is a cool, like, yeah, cypherpunk, cool tech thing to a, no,

this is fundamental, this is for everybody. And I think everybody, once they understand where the surveillance state is today. And people don't, people don't know that every American has their picture taken 85 times. We're close to China in terms of surveillance technology. They don't have no idea how much the financial surveillance is. Snowden has opened our mind up to a lot of this stuff, but trying to package that up to just to say, it's kind of like I said, we already have a central The stuff you're worried bank digital currency. about happened 20 years ago. the same is true with the Well, surveillance state. So once people can understand the present threat in the present situation,

then when you can paint to them what the future looks like, what a technocracy looks like, then we can get everybody on our side. That's how we shift the narrative. But right now we are struggling with a this is a renegade thing that only bad people use. And of course, part of the story as well is to say, who are the drug dealers and human Well, traffickers and the people doing money laundering? It's the governments themselves using fiat. The Pentagon can't find trillions of dollars after multiple audits. So the bad guys are not that, you know, some guy with a hoodie and a ball cap. The bad guys are at the Pentagon in Washington, D.C., but yet they control the propaganda and they make us

look like the bad guy. And there's a perception that we're the bad guy and we got to work together to fix that. At this point, they're just saying the quiet part out loud. It's pretty blatant and in your face. And pigtailing on to Aaron and throwing in my two cents, was it George that asked that question? I'm sorry. Who was it that asked? I asked the question. Okay, got it. Yeah, it's really easy to... to get disheartened and bitter and jaded and kind of throw your hands up. But I try to remain positive and think that there's few things more powerful than

an idea whose time has come. And I think we're, we're getting close to that. We're at that time, but more and more people are waking up to it. I keep going back to the fact that I think it's going to take a crisis. uh, before, uh, people move in mass, but, uh, crisis has always, always precipitated real change. If you, if you look back through history, you know, necessity is the mother of all in all invention, um, and several other quips and cliches you can throw in there. But, um, I, I say just, uh, do what you can in, in your local community. Um, and to Aaron's point earlier about starting small and letting that grow organically on its own. But being urgent about it.

And it's as simple as those of us that are in this space and use cryptocurrency are advocates of it, enthusiasts of it. This is as simple as asking your taco truck guy if he'll take crypto the next time you go to get tacos at the food truck. I ask everybody. I don't care where I am. I'll ask, even though I get weird looks half the time, I'll say, do you take crypto? And they'll often just look at me like I'm crazy or say something odd. But the more we can familiarize people with this, I don't think it so much matters to which pet coin you're shilling for which one you're a fan of I'm an advocate of bitcoin cash for a multitude of reasons just like others are

advocates for litecoin monero xeno nano there's a million of them out there and unfortunately it really has fractured the space considerably since 2017 but I don't think that matters so much because I think in the end the market will provide and push forth the one that is the easiest to use to use, uh, um, to, um, pigtail on Aaron's, um, a point earlier, you've got to have something that a soccer mom can use very quickly and easily before you're going to get mass adoption running to it. And the market will provide, I think, um, well, uh, privacy is a huge component of this and very, very important. Uh, uh, if you lead with that right

out of the gate and you push it, because some of these privacy coins are a little more complicated to use, you're going to lose people. You got to get people used to just dealing in an alternative form of currency first and foremost. Most people are used to being cashless at this point. Nobody actually whips out cash anymore. You're either swiping a debit or credit card or tapping to pay. So that's already there. We're already halfway there. It's just getting them to realize that, how negatively impactful fiat currency is. This is the one thing that impacts all of us, the rich and the poor, disproportionately, of course, the poor, but it impacts everyone. And it's a matter of

educating people about this fact and saying, hey, we have something else here that is hard, sound money that can't be screwed with, can't be toyed with, can't be manipulated and used in a predatory, hegemonic way the way the control flow of money have been doing for centuries now. We have something here. takes other than a real And I don't know what it crisis to make that happen. But you're seeing that shape up for all of the... the nasty things coming out of the power brokers' mouths, you're seeing things that are competing with the dollar at this point. You're seeing bricks start to organize. You're seeing the cracks in the foundation form.

You're seeing the jugular becoming exposed, and now we need to go for it at the end of the day. And I don't know how that happens, but I think there's no better way than doing it uh local on a small level um and using whatever you can to bolster that parallel economy and pork's uh points out pork fest is a prime example of this you can't go to pork fest with just one crypto you've got to have a slew of different things because there's groups that will the going to be different exchange and barter in different coins and so I don't think that matters so much. Um, and I, I hate to see the end fighting that happens within crypto. I'm, I'm, uh, waiting that cesspool on Twitter on a daily basis

and show what I show all other show what they show. Um, it's really divisive, but I think that's also, uh, you know, another method of control. It's a, it's one of the classic or war tactics of all time is divide and conquer. You get people squabbling amongst yourselves themselves and you do whatever the hell you want. But, um, And I think the point that I'm trying to make is not all of us have to work together. So we have to think about this from a, what does a merchant need for this to be viable? And so, because that is the pain point. 100% living on this, the pain point is merchants. And the number one pain point is point of sale system. So there is no single crypto

that's going to have enough buying power or enough people in their local area to make it worth their while to do a singular coin. This is why a couple of podcasts ago, I did a DEFCON 1 Manhattan project to do a... a wallet, multi-asset wallet, and to do a point of sale system. And where I ended up with is, and I don't know if you guys have tried CakeWallet. I recommend CakeWallet. But, you know, because my criteria on this is it needs to be open source. It needs to be multi-asset. And what they've built, what Vic has built and his team at CakeWallet actually So imagine when I do these workshops, I'm sitting in front of 100, 200, 300 people at one time,

and I'm trying to onboard them to crypto. And Steve, I mean, you know, I explained the situation that I had even... even in Silicon Valley with a smart group, they didn't use crypto, but they're a smart group and a wealthy group. And it's like going through and trying to get them onboarded with crypto today is not a great experience. And when I tried to explain, well, now you've got this crypto, what are you going to do with it? How are you going to pay your bills? How are you going to live? And it's like, okay, I can walk through 10 different things that we can do. Now, Cake Wallet already has BCH already has Litecoin. It already has Monero. I think it was built really for Monero originally.

They're adding Zeno, and then you can buy debit cards and gift cards from within the wallet. It's a self-contained situation. It's a clean UI. So now when I do the workshops, it's like, okay, here's multiple cryptos. and you've got privacy and you've got the ability to do these other transactions. It even has exchanges built into it, like the P2P exchanges that don't require KYC AML. Like it's actually a really well done product. So when we talk about what we need, that's what we need. Cause when you're trying to onboard people, they're not gonna have 10 different wallets, but they are gonna need multiple coins because again, there's not enough. Now I wasn't as big of a privacy,

uh, fan until frankly seeing, and you know, it's like, it's even like talking to Roger. It's like, okay, look, they, they chain analysis, did chain analysis on his stuff from, from 2012. Right. So, so, and, and, you know, and the thing is people will say, well, Because I'll get into arguments with people online that are like, oh, well, look at me. I know how to keep my stuff anonymous on Bitcoin. You must be an idiot here. Track this. I bet you can't find who I am. And it's like you've missed the entire purpose of all of this. Right. Who cares whether I'm not in chain analysis is a living. But I've got friends sitting in prison who are smarter than you were. smarter than you are that

have been doing this for 10 years, right? You're talking to this guy and it's like, so Ross Ulbricht? I mean, these are not stupid people. So what is it? Is it 150 IQ, 160 IQ that's required? Because what we know is they are going after people and they are using these tools and these techniques. So I would love to get, I don't know what the difficulties are. There may be some legal ramifications, but we get cash fusion If we can get... integrated into the wallet. If we can get Litecoin with Mimblewimble, if we can make that stuff easy, I mean, I like privacy by default, but if there's a way to make the other privacy stuff easy and integrated, then that's great because we need all of it.

Because there isn't, you know, Monero and Zeno don't do enough TPS to handle all of it. None of the individual coins do, but we've got to give people a package. Now, at the same time, I'm not for having a wallet that has 10,000 coins and 10,000 tokens in it. Because as I like to say, it's the 99% of crypto tokens that gives the other 1% a bad reputation. Although with central banks, it's the 100% that gives the zero a bad reputation. But if you think about it, ultimately, and this is really simple, and I'm going to codify this, but we have to beat big tech companies FinTech and CBDCs. So if the coin involved is centralized and can be

censored or the transaction fees are higher than provided in the marketplace, it's disqualified because it's not a better product or it's not at parity. It's not competitive. So the field gets winnowed down. So I'm not like, oh, I'm not for everything. I'm for a finite set, but we should all want to work together. We should all want to promote. And, you know, I mean, technology like early on, I know this doing you're doing it's called evangelism, but you're evangelizing the whole space, even though it doesn't feel like we should be evangelizing the whole space 15 years in. Unfortunately, we need to evangelize the whole space. And I think that there's a handful,

six different things that work together. And again, even with gold and silver and a So I'm comfortable for now tokenized basis. with where we are with this cake wallet. And I'm hoping that that continues to be the case. I've been really happy about that. And I'm looking forward to seeing how future workshops work with that. On the point of sale side, we've got to figure that out right away. And honestly, I've been kind of, you know, I was sick for a couple of weeks. And so I've been kind of I'm getting back into it. You were doing something with AnyPay, weren't you, Aaron? Can you elaborate on that? So what I think we can do is we can fork. AnyPay is a multi-coin point

of sale system that I've used that was used here in New Hampshire for a long time. And the devs behind it had to flee because the FBI was going after them when they were going after Ian Freeman. So they left New Hampshire. So they've open sourced the code. It was a good point of sale system. And it actually had Bitcoin Cash. It had Zcash. It had Monero. It had, I'll have to check. I think it also had Litecoin. So actually, you know, now it needs to be updated. There's still some work to be done. But like, that's a great starting point. And I've been having conversations with the Alpine people about tokenizing gold. And then, you know, I want to talk to Cake Wallet.

Maybe we work with Cake Wallet on this. Because you want to have a parallel wallet point of sale system if you can. So we're getting closer to this. And I'm obviously reengaging on this. And as I do more workshops, it always becomes more apparent. Because even if you can give somebody a wallet that has all these features, where are they going to spend the crypto? So it's like, okay, now you've got the crypto, where are you spending it? Now, yes, you can buy debit cards and gift cards. And that's a lot of what I do living on crypto, less so in New Hampshire. In New Hampshire, because it's been so prevalent, I can buy meat, I can buy milk, I can buy vegetables

directly with crypto without gift cards. But when I go anywhere else in the world, that's not true. So I'm using gift cards and everything else. That's an intermediate step. And that's fine. That's a risk, right? That could be shut off pretty quickly. with a piece of legislation. point of sale system down So we've got to get the so that there's a cohesive solution. And then I'm envisioning these workshops being able to onboard individuals and merchants to be able to target merchants. So when we're doing these things, we have two, three, four, 500 people. We have a breakout session for merchants and we show the merchants how to install the point of sale system. And so we can do this.

I really do believe we can do it, but if we don't get these tools right, to have the combined buying power and transactions per second with with the privacy elements because they are cracking down on the there is no scenario where they aren't going after privacy and there is no scenario where they aren't going after and tracking uh open ledgers and starting to go down a process of white listing or blacklisting that that is the the the uh loomis gillibrand thing that's already there that's baked in that's the best case scenario is all of that that's why there should be a feverish renewal of interest in privacy. and I think BCH people and Litecoin Um, people, I, you know,

I know a lot of times it's like, well, yeah, we can do this. Now would be the time to start using those features. Now would be the time to start obfuscating your holdings. Now, not, not even 60 days from now, maybe not even 90 days from now, right now, you want to have, if you're using a, an open ledger, you want to have whatever you currently have, uh, you know, de-anonymized or I mean, anonymized. So, um, I really believe that. And Steve, as you know, when we first talked, I mean, privacy had not been on the forefront for me at all. And pouring through all this stuff, it is now. Yeah, yeah, I just, I guess my point in earlier is that for a lot of these people,

it's going to be baby steps. And without the easiest solution for privacy that I've used thus far is cash fusion on Bitcoin cash, because There's a couple of wallets. The Stack Wallet, you literally click a button, it fuses your BCH, and you can spend it shortly thereafter. It's the easiest thing I've seen so far. So I don't know what else needs to happen to make that native out of the gate where people don't have to think about it while still keeping it fast and efficient. Maybe that's just a... something that has to come with the evolution of the technology. I don't know. It's really difficult

sometimes being an enthusiast in this space and not being a developer and knowing the nuance and tech behind all of this stuff, but learning day by day. So, you know, when I went to the conference in Slovenia, the Bitcoin Cash Conference, Bliss in Ljubljana, I did the entire trip on Bitcoin Cash and was able to use GoCrypto. a lot of the merchants over I'm sorry, there use GoCrypto and Alipay. And it just baffles my mind that there's not a prominent... outlet and a vendor here in the states for port and sell systems because it worked flawlessly um every time we used it over there with bitcoin cash now these vendors obviously they're probably 90 of them are

probably immediately swapping it to their fiat um uh currency of choice but they have the option of getting paid outright in whatever crypto you're paying as well point is is how is has nothing sprung up here yet that is at least offering that. It seems like the first to market here in the States would dominate because there is a desire for it out there. It just boggles my mind. I was going to say that two secondary pain points for a POS is the merchant. One is definitely in our favor, is the inflation level on fiat. That's in our favor. The secondary side is not so much in our favor, is the fluctuation of the price value of

whatever said crypto they're going to receive. And I think if something has charted and has a history of slow, gradual increase over time, that's going to be much more accepted. But the final, I would say, in summary, to answer your point, Steve, is I think you would probably agree. In the States here, people think of crypto and they think of Bitcoin. They don't think of crypto. They think Bitcoin is crypto and Bitcoin has these high fees. And so that would never work for, you know, a POS system. And I think that's part of it. And of course, it's regulatory capture that would put pressure on

merchants to accept it. What were you going to say, Aaron? That's my opinion. Well, so I've lived this. So, you know, again, I've been using Bitcoin directly since 2012 for restaurants and shops, right? And so, I mean, I can tell you what happens. The first thing that happened was, was this, so let's see where we were going. There wasn't anything before 2017. Everybody was using Bitcoin and large merchants like Overstock and Expedia and Microsoft and Steam were taking Bitcoin directly. You could literally use it directly. You didn't need a point of sale system. which isn't to say there aren't some Now, issues with integrating and so on and so forth, but at least people were using it directly.

When that hijacking happened, think about what happened. So most of the people were in Bitcoin and they were told that Lightning was going to be the solution. And that, yes, well, now we're buying a store of value narrative, but we'll get to payments later. We'll get to payments with this brand new shiny thing called Lightning Network. It's been nine years and it still doesn't work. So the problem is that all of those people have been basically sitting and waiting and then changing their narrative. And now they're using Visa cards and they're even whether you're what's his name? Song, I believe, he's like, yeah, use MasterCard. Even the Bitcoin core devs, yeah, no, use MasterCard. Or Saylor,

we don't want to compete with MasterCard. So that took a big bulk of it. So then what did you have? Well, you had Bitcoin cash, but then what you had left was most of the projects that were divided weren't working together. Everybody was so convinced their coin was it that you had people going to merchants, signing up merchants, signing up the owner, for their coin in their wallet. It was basically a niche thing that was all tied in a line to one coin. And so inevitably, you have these sites with all these maps of all of these merchants that take crypto. And if you go to them, 95% of them are dead. It was the owner who thought it was cool, speculatively five years ago,

and has never taken a transaction since. Now, there were some point of sale systems that were developed like BitPay, BitPay has a big point of sale service, but they don't accept new merchants. And actually, this is one of the problems. The problem is if you're running a point of sale system through a corporation, you are a centralized point of failure, which is why when I brought up doing this point of sale system project, it has to be open source. And so that the core project, no matter what they try to do, there's no central entity to shut down. That is a prerequisite. Well, there aren't. Where's the financial incentive then? So now when you look at Right. What kind of combination?

Where are you going to get people? Then you have any pay, which was successful. But the guys got run out by the FBI who wanted to rope them into this whole shakedown with Ian Freeman. So this is what actually happened. So this is what happened to all the players. Well, so now where are we? Where we are is when I go to these states and I ask people questions, most people don't even know you can use this stuff as currency. It's not even a known use case. For most people in the United States, crypto is only a speculative asset. And for most of those people, it's a negative one. It's a scam. So so that's so it's actually degraded that much. Like it's been just a sharp down line from 2017.

And so it can be solved, but it has to be solved with an open source solution. And it has to be solved with getting multiple assets to work together. And most people don't want most people just want to pick their coin as as as the one. And that can't work based on transactions per second buying power. It doesn't create a value proposition to the for the merchant. so so on that point I i hear you from a u.s perspective but again using the example in slovenia and go crypto which is um distributed all across europe this could be a good segue to um truly peer-to-peer transactions where go crypto I paid in Bitcoin cash,

the merchant can immediately swap that to their fiat of choice and get paid out in their fiat of choice. So, you know, merchants not going to go immediately to peer to peer because they have to pay employees, they have to buy inventory, there's a lot of other things in place here. But with Go Crypto, the merchant has the option of immediately switching it to euros and taking care of the expenses that they have. So why isn't something like that available here? And Go Crypto can accept multiple cryptocurrencies. You could spend Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash. I know at least those two. I think Litecoin as well. I didn't spend it there, but I think there's multiple cryptocurrencies.

I know at least Bitcoin and Bitcoin Cash you can spend with the Go Crypto point of sale system. Why do we not have something like that here is my question. There are several reasons. One is money transmitter laws. So the minute that you're doing that and the minute the actual act of converting the crypto to fiat requires a money transmitter license and requires KYC. That actually killed that. I would argue we shouldn't even try to do that. That's not even a good interim position because we know where fiat is going. That's going to be easy to ban. This is why what I'm trying to say is, Build a token, like allow a peer-to-peer without third party system to convert crypto to say

tokenized gold or silver that can be redeemed physically. So if the merchant is looking for a way to not have the ups and downs, I mean, gold and silver is better from a actual store of value. Now, I mean, you could argue Bitcoin has gone up, but I mean, if your real concern is stability than you actually probably would like to resolve to gold or silver. This is why tokenizing gold and silver and having that as something that can be done in a peer to peer way without an exchange with privacy tokens that can be redeemed for physical metals. I actually think that that's part of what I think needs to be built to offer that that stability. And then people are going to have to start moving away

from fiat as quickly as possible. This is why you need to find local networks of people that will start working together and not doing the fiat conversion because the fiat conversion is almost already dead. I will say that it is. So I've been introducing people to crypto lately and they're like, oh, I want to buy more of this. Which exchange do you use? And it's like Coinbase is horrible. The KYC process is so much worse now than it was. And now we know that they're tracking everything that goes in and out. So when you pull your Bitcoin out, the IRS knows you're tracked. You're tracked anything that you buy on an exchange now. going to try to do. So anything that you're

Now, there's one other important reason. when I bring up this tokenized gold, And by the way, because it still requires people to begin to accept tokenized gold. But this is a big issue, by the way, that BTC Maxis tell me. they all they complain oh well yeah the reason we don't use it is capital gains tax you don't want to use crypto because you have to pay capital gains on it so if you actually convert it to gold and silver then depending upon what state you're in you actually don't even have to pay the capital gains tax so you actually would get a stable currency that is not subject to capital gains and that actually may even be depending upon your state considered to be legal tender

Because I actually think that something like that is going to be necessary. So I'm looking at it from the merchant standpoint. The merchant needs to be able to take a lot of different cryptos, but those cryptos have to have transaction fees that are comparable to what is offered to the traditional system. And they need to be able to resolve it to a currency that is stable, that doesn't have horrendous tax implications. So that's part of what's And I see someone in the kind of ringing around. comments here said something about now payments. I love now payments. Now payments actually, I've used now payments for years. They have high fees, but basically when you use

now payments as a point of sale, I use it for my presidential campaign. You pick which crypto you want and it resolves to the single currency of your choice. So they already do that kind of behind the scenes stuff. The problem is the fees are high and they're based in the Netherlands. And so they're not dealing with the money transmitter issues laws that we're dealing with here. So from a point of sale system, I couldn't offer as a company. a point of sale system that did the exchange as a business, because that would be illegal. I would have to get a money transmitter law. If there was a, say something Zeno created, that was a peer to peer digital, you know, a peer to peer exchange

that allowed people to exchange without third parties that went on behind the scenes, somebody plugged in, then that's a different situation. But this is the level that we're kind of getting at in terms of trying to figure out how to bring a solution forward. What about you? I am. Go ahead. I was going to say, what about wrapped Bitcoin on Xano or something like that? You can do that, even wrapped BCH. One of the things that is a potentially promising element of Zeno is the ability to do that. There's already wrapped Ethereum, or there's already wrapped Zeno on Ethereum. And so this is one of the features. Now, I mean, it's still not foolproof because obviously they've been able to track,

what was the latest thing where they were able to track the timing and the amounts of Monero BTC exchanges and everything else? And so... There's a lot of complexity involved in all this, but that is one of the compelling things is that Zeno might help make other coins private. And so that's a huge feature. I don't know what the ultimate costs Now, of that are going to be and how much that affects whether the overall solution is viable for retail commerce and at what transaction value, but it is something that is exciting to investigate. I was just going to ask, you don't, you don't think there's an argument, even if a payment processor had to get a money transmitter license,

you don't think there's an argument for that as an interim. I just don't, I don't see maybe a local, a smaller mom and pop shop. I can see them going directly peer to peer. I just don't see it for the bigger box stores. Um, Just for the fact that let me let me know. Let me be clear. Fuck the bigger box stores. These are companies. Okay, I get that. I don't give a shit about the big box companies. Moving forward. These are the guys that want to own part of the technocracy. So I get that. Yeah. And I'm with you. But I'm but I also know that the sheep out there, the normies are going to want to go to Costco and Sam's and Walmart and buy their shit.

So there has to be a solution there if we want mass adoption. I'm 100% in agreement with you. I just think there's an argument for an interim until everybody moves peer-to-peer. The solution right now is to focus on the innovators. It's to focus on the 0.5%. Don't worry about mass market adoption. Find the people that are rabid about this that already understand it and get them using it so that when the time comes in the emergency, you've got an army of rabid people already using this stuff that can onboard the normies. The normies – and I want to go back to – I'm going to pull that back up because I really do – I'll pull it up on my – I love this quote because I

believe it's so accurate that if we really keep this in mind, and I always have to, because this comes up so often because people are like, well, what about the normies? And what I'm not saying is, oh, fuck the normies. What I'm saying is that the process of adoption for new ideas and new technology works in a very specific way. And the normies don't come until after. And the laggards may come. think about people that took 15 I mean, years to adopt a cell phone. We don't worry about those people now. We worry about that other group. So that statement, when an audience is presented with a theory that is one level above their understanding, they find it inspiring. When the information is two

levels above their comprehension, they fall asleep. At three levels, they become angry. And when the data reaches four levels above the level of the audience, they want to kill the presenter. So in this case, the normies that you're talking about, they're two and three levels removed. We don't need to worry about them now, but if we worry about those that are one level of understanding away and we onboard them and we get them as part of the team, then they will get the normies when the time comes. But the normies, the normies are the people that were late to the game on the, shots and everything else, we just have to build momentum towards a solution. And if I would say anything, it's like,

let's stop focusing on normies and let's start focusing on gathering the early adopters and working together as early adopters on solutions that will make it easy for the normies. But if we spend too much time trying to figure out interim things with money transmitter licenses and everything else, I will tell you this, because again, Ian Freeman, I sat in on his thing, right? I sat in on his sentencing hearing. I've watched what he does. I know people in New Hampshire that were on the operating ATMs doing things. cutting edge of this They thought they were doing it legally. Ian thought what he was doing was legal. He had an opinion letter from a lawyer saying he

didn't need a money transmitter license. This is a smart guy that got into Bitcoin in 2010. They got him anyway. With these money transmitter laws, they can fabricate anything. And it's such an easy choke point to get people kind of thrown out. And then by the way, what are you doing? You're just onboarding people to be KYC. And so this is why it's like, now my point is on privacy coins, I don't think Monero is difficult. I mean, I use Monero in the cake wallet, I guess I don't know what's difficult about it. I get Monero, I swap for Monero, I obtain my Monero, it's in a wallet, I spend it. or I buy gift cards with it. I either spend it directly There's no like, I'm not seeing the complexity.

Zeno's the same way. Zeno's not accepted by very many systems yet, but if now payments and others that are in the works start taking it, it's actually easy to use. With a user-friendly wallet like CakeWallet, when you're onboarding new people, it doesn't have to be difficult. It isn't. CakeWallet is. I don't know, Steve, if you've tried it, give CakeWallet a try. It's easy. It's really clean. It's a really clean wallet. I've enjoyed interacting. Actually, I tried to use it two nights ago. The one aspect that I found it was lacking in trying to scan a QR code image that was already on my phone. It doesn't have that image choice option. You have to actually scan it with your camera,

which they need to integrate that. But yeah, it's a clean wallet. I'll actually mention that. so what I like about them is And again, that they get this. So it's like they understand the usability. That's rare. So there's a good team of people there that are completely aligned. with the objectives here. So I think we can make it happen. But I want to stress, let's not focus on normies. Let's focus on the early adopters. And to me, the early adopters are people that were radicalized by COVID tyranny. Those are people that I will tell you, seven years ago, we never would have been talking to them. But they also haven't been tainted by crypto.

They're not like, oh, I was in this, you know, I was in the fork wars. You know, it's almost like, you know, you get a purple heart for which which of the four you're in and Bitcoin and everything. It's like, no, these people are are literally unaffected by this. Somebody's am I an astronaut? I'm drinking. I drink electrolytes. And this isn't an idiocracy thing, but I drink electrolytes. I drink electrolytes. It's got electrolytes. I drink electrolytes. I'm doing keto. I'm going full keto with a short window. So I'm keeping my electrolyte balance up. So that's what I'm doing. It's got what Aaron craves. you're giving these talks So, Aaron, throughout the country. Who should attend and what's

in it for them? Yeah. I mean, any anybody that doesn't want to have their free will taken from them should should want to attend. I mean, that like it truly is that now I'm saying this is kind of the chicken and egg thing. I haven't had an experience through the workshop and wasn't like, Oh, yet where somebody went wow, like, okay, this is serious, right? Like this is people get it. It's just how do you get people there and and the way that we get people there and you see the website that daylightfreedom.org which of course george george is actually responsible for that but I think the the hook is to go after groups that are like-minded and and I've got a list of them

I'll I'll publish it I've I've got a spreadsheet with them but you know gun groups You know, Second Amendment groups. Why? obviously it probably doesn't Well, I mean, even need explanation, but there's overlap there. School choice groups, health freedom groups, food freedom groups, groups that are opposed to ESG, groups that are opposed to people that don't like the pronoun stuff. the pronoun stuff actually Because, by the way, was generated through the WEF. In the UN, the UN actually pushed the pronouns and the WEF lapped it up and adopted it, which is why when you go on LinkedIn, everybody's got their, you know, their pronouns on there. That was actually pushed. So people that don't like

that should be aligned with this because because once because part of the talk and part of the first chapter of my book is to explain people what the technocracy agenda is about. Once you understand the technocracy agenda, you will not want to be a part of it. And so those are all groups. Libertarian groups are a fit. uh republican groups are a fit I mean at this point mag is a fit too because I you know if if you are a trump supporter and a trump fan clearly you're you've experienced lawfare and you understand the deep state at this point right and now people are starting to question the federal reserve even though they're massively manipulating the you know inflation numbers

I don't think anybody really believes inflation is coming down but what here's what I've experienced so far in the people that I've met and that I've talked to. A lot of people got radicalized by COVID, and then they got radicalized by inflation. And then they started asking questions like, what is all this inflation about? What is the Federal Reserve? These aren't people that were reading End the Fed by Ron Paul before, but they're now starting to read End the Fed. And they're like, wow, that's how money works? This is why my next article, I'm gonna try to make it as simple as possible. Once you understand how profoundly, I mean, the money is, I mean, it's a Ponzi scheme,

but it's a Ponzi scheme built on horrendous technology. And I think once people know that, I mean, if I can figure out a way to explain that in a way that is accessible, then I think you're gonna find more people are gonna be like, wow, yeah. They're gonna be no longer sitting there saying, oh yeah, the dollar, nothing's ever gonna happen to the dollar. I mean, even on that, like our whole lives, global reserve currency. the dollar has been the Most people would never even question that. Why would you? It's never come up. Nobody ever taught it in school. We teach economic literacy as being how well you're able to do addition and subtraction on top of a Ponzi scheme. You're doing accounting on

top of a Ponzi scheme. We call that financial literacy, which is hilarious. We don't actually teach how money works, where money comes from. That's not in any curriculum. It's not even an economics curriculum in college. At no point do people learn how money works. So I think these people that are radicalized, and interestingly, So most of the people in the workshops that I'm in have had no crypto before. They've had no wallet. And that's when it really clicked for me. And it's something that we being in crypto have to understand. 95, probably 98% of people have never used cryptocurrency to make a transaction. So we may be in the weeds fighting it out amongst ourselves.

All of the market is in front of us, all of it. I mean, it's good news, bad news. The good news is we've got a whole new field of people that haven't been tainted by everything that's going on. The bad news is CBDCs are creeping up and they're on a hyper accelerated path and we're like behind, we're at the bottom of the ninth. And most people within crypto are unaware of kind of what I've just said. And it's eye opening. And I think it's going to be good when people participate in these workshops to see. But yeah, Republicans and all of these groups that I that I mentioned, even Republicans. I mean, at some point, Democrats will probably like it, too, depending on what the issue is.

But I haven't had a I can't say that I've had a big. group, I don't know, maybe RFK supporters now, there is one benefit of this political stuff is that it has people claiming they're against certain things. They don't know what it is, right? Like RFK, all of these policy things are misdirected and they misdescribe and mischaracterize what's going on, but people think they're against CBDCs, even though they don't know what they are. And so that's an opportunity. So I actually think RFK supporters are another And by the way, they'll be even more excited once they realize that their candidate doesn't even get five percent about how bad the process is. Right. And this is a little I'll

say this is a little bit of a diatribe. the best case scenario is Harris But to me, The Republicans win the Senate. wins as president. The Democrats win the House because. We need people to stop believing that politicians can save things, but we also need enough gridlock to be able to buy us enough time to implement these alternative solutions. Majorities in either side are horrible for us because the Republican actual policies on crypto are horrible. They're maybe not as bad as the Democrats. It's actually indistinguishable. anybody to have complete control. So we just don't want And we need to get people on board with the idea that we can't vote our way out.

We need to kind of address this ourselves. And you don't want them unified by any means because that's when you know you're absolutely going to get fucked. And by the way, Yeah. that's what's happening now. Chuck Schumer sitting there saying, oh, we're going to try to pass a bill, this crypto for heresy. That's the worst thing that could ever happen. Whatever bill would get signed before this election would be an absolute disaster. So imagine if an RFK supporter and a gun rights activist is sitting in between somebody that has been encouraged to attend your meeting based on COVID tyranny. What will the three of them be happy that they've walked out of there with?

Well, I think they'll be tangibly or knowledge wise. I think people will be. I don't know if they'll be happy, but they will be enlightened about the fact that there is a much more coordinated strategy that's further along. So I think they will be grateful for the knowledge of how serious and well-funded this is. And they'll be happy about the fact that they actually have alternative assets directly in their possession that they've been shown how to use. Because the thing for me with this, even in doing this, I don't like going around and just, there are so many people spreading doom. I mean, everybody's spreading doom, right? Because there's a lot of doom. But to me,

it would be horrible to just go and add more doom. We're at the point right now where it's almost People getting more awake is only good to the extent you can do something about it. It's actually demoralizing if you get more information where it's like they're so blatantly. I mean, it's like this assassination thing with Trump. It's like, you know, people like, oh, it's great. We have freedom of speech. We're going to be able to find out what's going on. It's like, no, all we got was like. more conspiracy theories than we got about JFK proliferated in a two week period of time rather than 60 years. And there's no actual information about what happened and no actual truth behind it.

And so at that point, it's like more demoralizing. How many more? We don't know what happened to Jeffrey Epstein. We don't know what happened to JFK. We don't know what happened to Trump. How much more these guys are bad and this is corrupt can we take without actually having tangible solutions? So I think the thing they'll be grateful for is getting them over the hump because I wrote my book to be self-contained. I wrote my book so that you can read the book. You can read the first part and it's like, oh my God, they're out to kill us. And then you read the second half of the book and it's like, to download a wallet. here are the instructions Here's how you pay your bills with crypto.

Here's how you get gold. Here's how to look at all of this, like tangible steps. But what I found when I talked to people, especially older people, is they said, listen, I loved your book. I get that this is a problem, but I just couldn't get myself. to download a wallet or to be able to get crypto. that's the response I got back was, Overwhelmingly, now I know this is a problem, but I just haven't been able to take that step. That's why I'm doing the workshops. So then they can walk out being like, oh, it's not that hard. At least that's the hope now. So with a cake wallet or whatever, this isn't that hard. People love goldbacks, by the way. I will say people love goldbacks.

Um, cause they get it. And people attending your meeting, will they walk out with a gold back? Yeah, they'll walk out with a gold back. They'll walk out with a crypto wallet. They'll, they'll have, you know, two cryptos probably. I want to be careful about I, you know, what to say because some of this changes from event to event, but For the New Jersey event, Monero and they're going to they're going to have have Zeno and they're going So they're going to have an to have a token. actual tokenized asset. They're going to have a wallet with the ability to create their own tokens. And they're going to have a cake wallet with Monero that they can actually spend and use to buy gift cards and to

start making transactions. And so it's a great first start. I will say the missing piece now, and I I'm trying to figure this out. If anybody has any ideas, I suspect it's cracking, but I actually need, I need to find a partner to work with at the exchange level, because I want to be able to like, that's easy to onboard. And as much as I hate, I do hate exchanges. And of course, and I want to make it clear that, you know, always self-custody. Never leave anything on an exchange. Leaving crypto on an exchange is like leaving money in a bank. willing to lose. Never leave more than you're But at the same time, inevitably, if I give somebody $5 or $10 worth of crypto, that's not going to change

their life behaviors. And then the next question is going to be, how do I buy more crypto? So that is the piece that now needs to be solved. And I'm thinking it's probably going to be cracking, but that is a that is a risk that I mean that is that that remains a risk now on the other hand what's interesting about this is if you look at a lot of these coins most of the coins have already been uh are you know what is it 93 of the bitcoin and bitcoin cash and and bsv is already out out there I mean there's there's not much left to be mined um and so with most of these coins now it's just a quick so the worst thing that can happen is all the coins have been mined and people

are sitting on them and not using them We actually need velocity of this stuff. And so if people continue to hodl, whatever it is, we're going to be stuck. So I don't know how to resolve that problem. I don't have an answer for that, but I'm hopeful we can get more people using it and more people getting paid, more people paying vendors and paying employees with it. I've got a few ideas on these points that you're just making. For one, I saw somebody in the chat mentioning Fold Card. It's a card that I've been using for a few years now. It pays rewards in BTC Bitcoin. But from there, you can send that BTC to

any wallet or address you'd like. I typically will earn my rewards in BTC, send it to ThorChain. swap for BCH, and then I've got it self custodial in my in one of my wallets. The nice thing about it is you can now pay anything linked to the routing number and bank account that's tied to the fold wallet. So I actually pay my mortgage and all utilities. And then with PayPal, you can actually double dip. So I'll actually put most everything on cash back credit cards, pay those credit cards off. So I get rewards on my credit cards, my cash back and rewards credit cards. I pay those credit cards off

with the fold debit card through PayPal's bill pay service, double dipping and earning BTC rewards. And it's the easiest way that I've been able to on, I guess, on ramp, from fiat to crypto on expenses that I have to to pay on an ongoing biggest basis it's a no-brainer in my opinion it's not perfect because yes you're ky seed in the process but you can at least get it into the crypto space um in that regard as far as onboarding um I don't know if you've tried out uh the cash stamps um tool that we just launched a couple of days ago or not aaron but I think in the past you and I have worked together on the faucet which um had mild success, I guess,

after some trial and error. But these cash stamps are really, really neat and convenient to onboard people to Bitcoin Cash, at least. We're using it for Bitcoin Cash. stamps.cash. You can create your own QR code stickers, denominated however you want. If you just go to stamps.cash and then for the end user, they go there as well and click on the redeem button. You literally hand them a sticker or a QR code. It's got instructions on it says to redeem, go to stamps.cash. It's two steps. It instructs them to download the bitcoin.com wallet. We want to work with other wallets as well. So hopefully this is something Kate could adopt as well. Step one is install the wallet.

Step two is scan the QR code and they immediately have Bitcoin cash in their wallet. So something you might want to use in your next seminar instead of the faucet. But I know you're trying to do it all at once in a group setting, which is a different dynamic. But anyway, my two cents there on onboarding and moving things around. and earning crypto on every expense that you have in my opinion while fold still is tied to a broken crippled btc it's still a way to earn crypto and then you can swap it via thor chain for whatever you want yep yeah I mean this is this is the thing it's like so again talking to boomers anything involving d5 thor chain all this other stuff

it's like it's way too look i But I'll play around. I have a fold card and I actually don't use it because it's BTC, but I'll take a look at it. But, you know, the issue is for if we are going to we have to work on building. My point is we have to start building products now, all working together that are. as easy as when the CEO of USDC showed that you can use USDC tap to pay with Apple. If we're not working towards that, if we have stuff that's multi-step, but when that emergency comes, we're lost. Because I will tell you, the CBDC technology doesn't require even a computer.

It doesn't even require internet access. They're putting this stuff on NFC. This is a bit of a tangent, but a lot of people said to me, oh, look, Aaron, people don't like CBDCs. Look at the failure in Nigeria. Yeah. And that's a bad take because Nigeria only has 45% internet access. The reason the World Bank and the IMF picked Nigeria is as a test case for how to work through some of the issues in rural populations. And by the way, they've worked some of this stuff out. Think about it. Welfare, EBT cards, right? People get EBT cards. You don't need an app to use an EBT card. You get basically a debit card, right? Well, you can do the same thing with... CBDCs using NFC cards.

These are some of the things that they're testing. They're even looking at using post offices as places where you can go to do CBDC-related transactions. And so I say this because, and I'm going to do more because I've only scratched the surface on this, but we need to understand when they roll out CBDCs, it will be user-friendly for everybody to be able to use. So if we've got stuff that looks like a Rube Goldberg machine and we've got to go through nine different steps, we fail. We have to be better than them at the user interface. This is why I don't like the, like we have to move away from interfacing with this and doing all of this other stuff. We've got to go for the,

the early adopters. We need to get the 0.5% early adopters that are the people that are willing to fight through it. So, you know, we'll get better solutions because I don't, because for me using this, it's inconvenient, right? Well, but what, what solution is there now that local Bitcoins and local Monero has been, um, tanked what is the on-ramp non-kyc fio to crypto is there one I mean another one exists unless you can find a person that'll actually buy it for cash again local bitcoins was the easiest way so what is there in that regard There's nothing that I know of. Well, there is. I'll talk about it. I'm not recommending this because I'm not sure if the exchange is good. But by the way,

these are some of the solutions that we are going to be moving towards. This idea of a network state. So I've actually signed up for Josian. I'm a denizen of Josian. I don't know if you're familiar with this. It's kind of an interesting story. It's a nation state. It used to be back in the 1300s. That was actually part of Korea. and it has a long history behind it. It was actually, it used to have a physical location, but now it's a first cyber state. Roger Ver is the minister of finance. It actually has a pretty long story, but the king is somebody that's actually tied to the lineage of the whole history of this thing. And you can sign up for it and get your kind of citizenship,

if you will, or denizenship. And you can form corporations and you can actually engage in that cyber city that is actually has recognition from certain UN nations. And there is an exchange that I can actually sign up for using my Josian ID. Josie and he spell it j o s e o n. So so so what I'm saying by the way, so when I'm saying this, I want to be disclaimer this by saying I'm experimenting with this. So I'm not this isn't going to be part of the workshop because this is this is an island off the off the coast of South Korea, correct? Well, it's not it's not really an island. It used to be it was part of South Korea. Now there's no physical there's no geography at all. Okay.

Now it's literally it's literally 100 percent cyber. And I actually when when Roger was arrested, I actually reached out. I talked to the guy that I've talked to a whole bunch of people and they're like, all right, I signed up for this. So so I have an account in an exchange that's been KYC with my Josie and Denison ship. So I've got unlimited, you know, whatever. And I'm not suggesting that because I, now with that said, I haven't used that exchange because there's some iffy things related to that. but there are other pro there are other projects like this roger and a whole bunch of other people I know mark edge has been working on this there are a lot of people that are

working on this idea of buying sovereignty so basically getting building networks and of people together and getting those people together to buy sovereignty and then based on that sovereignty you you can actually I mean just people have dual citizenships right people have dual citizenships here I think half of congress has an israeli citizenship or whatever it happens to be but this is something This is something that's very telling, isn't it? But I want to be very clear about what my position is on this. America 1.0 is over. We have to start building alternative solutions. Every single piece of effort wasted on trying to work within the existing system is a diversion that makes

our getting stuck in it more likely. I mean, I do think it's like wherever you place your energy and your attention, that means something. So if we're spending our time hedging, If everybody's hedging on the thing that they don't want, then collectively that's going to bring the thing that people don't want. So we've got to start working outside. And with this, it's a firehose because it's like how many different things are you going to pursue simultaneously? That is one of the things that I'm pursuing. And I've said this very clearly. I will never form a business in the United States of America again. Let me be very clear. Fuck the SEC. I'm done with this. I went golden 2012.

If this were me, look, if this were me, I started my first company. I was 19. I would have probably thousands of employees right now if I were playing within the system. Right. I've already deprived them of, of, of a lot of stuff. I'm, I'm out of that system. And there are a lot of people working on different alternatives, but that's, I, operating a few cylinders in the background not not a lot we've got to get people into peer-to-peer and and again this is why I i want to stress I don't want to get mass we're not if we're focusing on mass adoption we're missing the point we're missing the point about where we are we're at 0.4 of all cryptos combined being used for retail

transactions we're not at a mass adoption state We're at a declining state. Exactly. I was going to say it's shrinking too. If that's not evidence for hijacking, I don't know what is. Well, it is. But we've got to put together a solution that we pound through it and we work on building the solution for the really early adopters. And look, I will tell you. I wouldn't have been this. I wouldn't even say excited about it if we didn't have COVID tyranny. Maybe we wouldn't be in this situation. But there are so many pissed off people. I mean, and again, this is what I love about the Brownstone Institute. I do want to say this. This is so I mean, I ran for president to

raise awareness on this issue. And I've done activism and I was able to get a lot of press in the past doing activism. And I literally ran for president on a platform of a bank run manifesto, telling people to exit the banks and boycott public health and pull your kids out of public school. And I would have thought, at least even based on my own track record, at least mainstream media would have said, look at this tinfoil hat, right? At least I would have gotten that. And they did nothing. And I have a database with 3000 PR contacts. I sent them multiple press releases. These are people that have covered me before. Some of these people I know, no one would cover

And I actually filed before Vivek filed. And the reason that I'm saying this is this is powerful. The mainstream media wants to shut down the fact that if a couple of percent of people exit using the fiat system, it collapses their entire thing. It literally takes so little to collapse. So what we need to do now is we need to focus on those innovators. Don't worry if the mass adoption people look at you funny. Again, they're at the level three and four, according to this Charles Tartt quote. Or level two, they're either falling asleep or they're going to be angry. Or they might want to kill you if you get the wrong person. Or they might move up. They might move up from

their position and see you as a safe haven. Right. So if we get these early adopters, so the Brownstone Institute was formed when all of the Beltway libertarian groups like Cato, everybody that should have come out against the lockdowns and the mandates, none of them did. None of them did. So Jeffrey Tucker started this thing. And the people involved in this that I've met are people I never would have met in a million years. And I've known Jeffrey for 10 years. And we've actually been in events together and done everything else. These are different people than we ever would have met. And they cross political boundaries and everything else. But the people that are at

the Brownstone Institute that are fellows, they're people that lost their jobs, lost family and everything else for speaking the truth, whether it was speaking the truth, whether we see them today. Dr. Corey. Pierre, Corey, Corey, Pierre, whatever, a couple of doctors that just got their licenses revoked for ivermectin. The guy that's the head of the FLCCC revoked. And I've seen him in a lot of, you know, brownstone events. And they're there. They work together. These are never people that we would have talked to. These are doctors. These are people from academia. These are people from a university setting. that were fired. These are people like Brett Weinstein. I'm telling you,

there is an audience of people here that if you're in crypto and you're just in the echo chamber, you wouldn't even think that these people exist. They exist and they're really pissed off. they're incredibly pissed off but they've never touched a cryptocurrency in their life and they're open to it so so we look at these groups and it's like so yeah I'm excited about but I only want to focus on them for now because they're really engaged they get it I'll tell you, it's almost the perverse thing is, and it's not anybody can join this, but it's like Gen Z is harder than boomers. It's completely counterintuitive to me. If you would have said to me five years ago, yeah,

I'm going to focus on boomers. I'm focusing on doing workshops with boomers instead of Gen Z. I would laugh at myself for even suggesting such a thing. But they get it. And by the way, the other thing, a lot of religious groups get this. Hardcore religious groups that are looking at kind of the mark of the beast see this as an end times thing. So these are people that if you look at the crypto Twitter echo chamber, they'd never even consider this. That's our hotspot. Get the people that are doing this because they know it's about the legacy for their kids and their grandkids. Get the people that are doing it because they lost their job over it, that have been censored for it,

that have actually lost friendships and family. Those people will push and fight for this to the end of the earth. And they represent different demographic groups so that when the time comes and we've got to scale this up, we have in our 0.5%, people that actually represent a wide swath of demographics. So then when the shit hits the fan and they want to bring in price caps and they want to bring in CBDCs, then we've got a wide array. It's not just the tech guys or the libertarian guys talking to their community. We've got a huge demographic in our kind of army of innovators and early adopters. So to me, this is where I think we can be successful and just learn how to just, yeah, okay,

the people, and it always is, well, this mainstream adoption isn't going to take, yeah, don't focus on mainstream. Mainstream adoption is three levels away from where we are. We're not ready for mainstream. We would have been ready for mainstream. If Bitcoin wasn't hijacked, Bitcoin was hijacked. We're now worse strategic. We are worse for, from an adoption perspective than we were seven years ago. We are worse because of the hijacking. I would agree with that. Well, Aaron, you got any thoughts on, you know, there's a lot of people are losing their jobs right now. A lot of pain points where, what, Where could they go for this kind of thing as an opportunity? I'm not trying to say push

number go up and pump some kind of meme coin. I'm not talking about that. I don't know. There are going to be individuals who are going to be desperate for opportunity or to make opportunity happen or come to them because they lost their job. Any ideas or thoughts for that group? My thinking on this is those 50 categories of assets. And again, assets mean everything. Those 50 categories of assets, every single one of those categories is a market opportunity to disrupt the status quo. There's an unlimited opportunity. So look at it this way. The default is a one world technocracy where it's Elon Musk versus Microsoft.

That's the final polarity. And they're carving up who's going to control free will and whose engineers and scientists are going to make decisions for us. What that means is everything else is open. Every market segment. If you actually wanted to say, all right, I want to come up with decentralized private solutions, every market is open. Literally every market. So how now how do we translate that? I don't know yet. This is why I've got to go through this process of simplifying. Well, first I have to research and then I have to and then understand it. And then I have to figure out how to communicate this. But I'm planning on putting out a lot of content in a lot of different forms.

I don't know. Maybe I'll do podcasts where I'll get people in these industries that can come on. But but you're you're 50 asset list. Where is that? It's on a Google sheet. I'm working on it, too. I haven't released it publicly because I need to edit it. I need to do some more refinement. But it's literally, you know, I'll pull it up and just read some of it because, again, it's there. And there is another aspect to this, which I don't necessarily want to go into this now. It's one of the things that bothers me about the hijacking of Bitcoin is that. not only supposed to have peer to peer digital cash, but there was the possibility of having micropayments and micropayments.

Micropayments revolutionize everything. Micropayments make available business models that have never existed before. They disrupt Silicon Valley. We go back to those click wrap agreements that Silicon Valley's had us sign. Well, what are they really all about? We're the product and those contracts are us selling our data and us selling our assets to Silicon Valley. Micropayments fixes that. And, and, and we're not, we're not there. We're not even at basic payments, let alone new micro payments. But I, but you want to like, to me, the entire universe is open. There's an infinite number of opportunities and things. The challenge is I, so as we're going through this is it's complicated, right?

I wrote a 9,400 word article. I wanted to get that out there as something to reference, but now I want to go through and be specific. about all of these different industries and all these different things people can do. And by the way, they should build it up from the perspective of these people, these World Economic Forum companies and these big box companies. These people do not have good intention for us. Obviously, big pharma does not have good intention. Big media, all of this stuff can be... disrupted but they in order for people to understand what the opportunities are they have to understand how badly they've been duped by the existing system and to realize that the

opportunities come from completely outside of the system if they're looking for ways to you know get in on the system I got news for you that they're the people that are pushing this they'll depopulate us if if they need to they view us literally and it's not an exaggeration to say they don't believe in free will and they view us as optional extras. They view us as, as like, you know, literally batteries to plug into their system. There's no, and, and so once you get out of that system, then anything is open for creation. I'm just, I'm trying to find the, the list. After you pull up that list, your next workshop is October 5th, Saturday in New Jersey. That's like, there's at least a half a

million people within a 30 minute drive. If you extend it out to an hour drive, if somebody was that compelled to come to your workshop, we start to get into like six to 8 million. Once you start to, you know, to look at that radius, how many seats are available? We only have three, there's only 300 seats. So, and you know, we're working on, I would like to scale these up to be bigger events, but there's, work that has to go. Fortunately, somebody from CakeWallet is going to be there. So we're actually going to get some help on that front. But it's capped at 300. So I think people should register sooner rather than later. There's early bird pricing. So I would register before

September the 5th. That's when the price is go up but so what you can actually tokenize is again remember it's actually everything and it's it's all it's everything that already exists it's all real world assets it's also digital assets and it's things that are not even on this planet and it's information and if you're doing it right And I don't know that Zeno, because of the privacy aspects of it, I'm not sure it's cost effective to do microtransactions on tokenized assets on Zeno, which isn't to say that it can't become that way. My understanding is there's the potential for an adaptive block size limit with that as well. But I don't want to represent that. And by the way,

I really am trying to understand the technology, which is a big, deep dive. But in addition to the stocks, bonds, rivers, all the other stuff, you have Oil and gas, agricultural commodities. I saw somebody put CSAs on there. It's like, yeah, no, I mean, you can not only, you can tokenize raw milk, tokenize and trade, you know, stuff through local farms, fine art, collectibles, music. patents and trademarks, NFTs, asteroid mining, virtual real estate, intellectual property. I mean, I put on here carbon credits, not that I think that's a good use case, but I was going through and researching, you know, looking at, I was actually looking at it from the perspective of what are they likely to be

tokenizing based on the 17 sustainable development goals. You can tokenize loyalty points, utility tokens, gaming assets, Real estate, investment trusts, crowdfunding shares, digital art, AI models, digital identity, tickets and event passes, charitable donations, travel booking, subscription services, legal contracts, food safety tracking, retail coupons. uh microfinance art galleries supply chain finance you could even tokenize by the way this is what because a lot of this I was looking at um for ravencoin you could tokenize lawsuits you can actually tokenize class action lawsuits because there are some interesting carve-outs because it's not a typical sec thing there's

this weird weird carve-out which um you know again I don't know how exciting that is if you're trying to exit the system but you could actually kind of crowdfund a uh a lawsuit um so In any event, anything in short. So I want to go through these and even some of these have subsets where it's like, okay, all of this is on the table. Because once you break down, so the way stocks work is mind blowing to me. So we don't own the stocks. There's one company called Seed & Company, which is a subsidiary of DTCC, which was started by somebody from the CIA that owns all of the physical stock certificates for publicly traded stocks. And it's so to the point where when there was a flooding,

Hurricane Sandy a few years back, and it like wiped out a million stock certificates. It takes three days to settle stocks because they actually have to physically move these stocks certificates that are held by this one company that technically owns these shares. So when you think you own a stock through your broker, you just have a number that refers to a stock certificate that's owned by somebody else. This is how the stock market works. Right. You probably sitting there thinking, oh, well, these guys have got they're doing all this high frequency trading and all this other stuff. This infrastructure must be just awesome. And then it's like one company owned by a CIA operative has physical

stock certificates in a building in New York. Are you kidding me? We're ruled by clowns. if that's how stocks work how do you think all of the rest of this stuff works so well they limit their own market too because they they don't allow you know foreign investment or something like this and so you could tokenize it and you with xano or something like that and you could put it out there for the globe and so you know someone in zimbabwe could buy a share or a portion of a share of disney where they could well they wouldn't have access just as an example So one of the things, my first company I started, I raised money from 150 angel investors, which was a nightmare. Maybe it was 180.

It was a nightmare. And I had to fill out all these SEC paperwork, all this SEC paperwork, and people had to sign these forms, which by the way, was much better than it was today. It used to be that you could say you were an accredited investor. You could say you had a certain net worth and you could invest, right? So they have all these rules that only rich people can invest in startups, right? And of course, it's not actually to protect investors. It's to protect venture capitalists and private equity firms. But you could lie because it was like a self-report thing. It's like, oh, well, yeah, I have $300,000 worth of assets, which I think was the hurdle 30 years ago or whatever it was. Now,

you have to provide financial statements. You actually have to provide proof. You have to go through a validation process to show that you're an accredited investor. We've screwed up capital markets. If you could use privacy tokens to enable anyone anywhere to invest in any enterprise of any size with no third parties, you could completely open up finance. So the number of possibilities here, crowdfunding, like I could go on and on and on and on. But again, with all of this, it's like I've got to figure out how to go through each of these markets, learn how they work, explain how they work, make it simple. But I think in doing that, then people are like, oh, wow, that's how this works.

And then people will come up with a million ideas. I can just come up with a way of saying this is why this sucks. And here's some technology. And then other people can figure that out. But the opportunities are literally unlimited. The US is just it's a it's a scam. The SEC is horrible. And it's not even just what they've done to crypto. The SEC was always horrible. People are just now finding out about it. Imagine doing a crowdfunding and tokenizing a lotto winning. So someone would get the payout from you, so many cents on the dollar, and they would be crowdfunded, and then the state would pay their monthly payment or whatever, their annual payment, if someone wanted to take

it over 20 years or something. H.G. Wentworth. H.G. Wentworth. You know, you could tokenize, you could do a prediction market. Anyway, there's so many different things to do. But again, it's how to... Now, the issue with all of this is all the tech needs to be made easy. But we still need at the base level money, peer-to-peer money that people can use that's easy. And then the stuff that can be built on top of that, we need APIs and tools and everything else. The frustrating part is that we're like with the very early stage. It seems like after 15 years... we would be off to the races and we're not, we're actually, we've regressed and that's a problem, but there is a way forward.

So, you know, again, I'm optimistic. It's just a question of, can we get this information out? And this information will be suppressed. If you're listening to this, All of the information I've gotten out, if it weren't for the Brownstone Institute, probably no one would know about this because even running for president didn't do a whole hell of a lot, except I was able to talk to other presidential candidates, which is, you know, at least I can tell you why I don't believe anything any of them say. But that doesn't actually help the cause of pursuing the solution. to CBDCs, but anybody that has any other podcasts, like this is all about getting on podcasts. And remember,

this is about getting to that 0.5%. I don't want to go on MSNBC. I have no interest in Fox News. It wouldn't do anything. I'd go on to Fox News and a bunch of people would be pissed off. This guy doesn't like the dollar. You know what I mean? It's like it would end up generating, it would be a net liability. It's a net negative. We're not there. We need the people. This is a small podcast that have niche groups of people that are already committed to this stuff. I did a podcast last week. they have a, you know, four or 500 viewers or whatever guys in Virginia. And at the end, we're going to do a workshop there. He's, he's a member of the VFW. We're going to do a workshop there.

Those are better groups than, than mainstream. Cause that's, those are our people that we're trying to, to, to bring into this. So anybody that has any ideas or, or any shows, I'm open to it. I wanna get the word out to the receptive people that have been radicalized to a point, but not necessarily aware of this aspect of it or what the solutions might be. Yeah, Rob says in the chat, politics is a waste of time. I couldn't agree. Parallel economies, it's already happening. I agree, I agree. Counter-economics. So in New Jersey, what other workshops should people try to sign up for? I mean, sign up for any workshop.

And if you go to the daylightfreedom.org site, there are 15 cities or so listed there. If your city's not on there, indicate that you're interested. So here's the issue. So the reason we picked those cities is based on demand. So people from reading my articles or whatever filled out a form stating they're interested in a CBDC workshop. So we know where there's interest. The challenge for us is, is I mean I'm in new hampshire it's it's me my wife part-time and george who you're hearing uh part-time that I mean there's no there's no big organization here there's no well-funded apparatus here I'm running a non-profit that you know is not necessarily break even. I'm just trying to get the

word out at this point and make it self-sufficient. But we go to where the interest is. And the biggest pain point is finding a venue. And the thing is that people are, you know, we were in a church, Calvary Church in Silicon Valley. This was the church that defied the shutdown orders. They had to pay millions of dollars of fees. They refused to pay the whole nine yards. So that was the venue. So we only paid 150 bucks or something like that for the venue. So what we're trying to find is people that might know on the ground, a venue that would be willing to host this kind of event. VFWs, we're doing the next, the New Jersey thing, I think is it an Elks Club or whatever.

And so churches, this isn't fancy. We're not going for ornate. We're not going for expensive. We need a room that has some adequate seating that can seat a lot of people. I mean, I can bring my own projector, microphone, uh computer like literally we just need a you know a podium and some chairs uh in a space that's in a safe area with some parking and that's and then we're off to the races so on the forms that you fill out on the website it indicates you can indicate whether you can help with the venue or help sponsor or help market the event so the way that we market these events is we find like-minded groups like I think we had 10 partners for the California event.

So a lot of health freedom groups and, and actually some interestingly, some organ religious groups that, that, that, um, were more, they're conservative, but they, I don't know how to describe it, but it was weird. A lot of these were through the Silicon Valley, Liberty Forum of Silicon Valley and related groups. And what we do is we give their members a coupon code to buy the tickets so they can get $25 off. So their members can get $25 off. So the best way for us to make these events happen is to find somebody that can help with a venue and And then find as many partner groups as we can to invite their pre-existing members to the event. That is the home run with this.

We're not spending any money on advertising. And most of the inbound leads have come from my Brownstone articles that have appeared on Twitter. uh, zero hedge. That's, that's actually the biggest source of, of the leads. And, and then some of these podcasts, actually, I did one with Mike Adams, decentralized TV that we got a flood of, uh, I think we got 50 plus leads off of one podcast of people that want to participate in these workshops. So, so doing stuff like this really helps. But if you know anyone that, uh, any, you know, again, podcasts or, or groups that would want to partner to help promote this, um, That's how all this happens. It happens organically based

on people's demand and interest. We're not forcing any issue. We're not like, oh, we got to go to this state. And if we don't know anybody and there's no interest, we're obviously not going to do it. But I will go wherever the interest is. Which hopefully will be Hawaii in February. All right, well, we've been going for a while here. Actually, we got pretty good attendance. I'm actually pretty happy about this given how late the notice was. If there are any other questions, I'm happy to answer any other questions or if not, we can start wrapping this up. Somewhat unrelated in the hijacking Bitcoin, whatever happened to Dylan?

I haven't found anything. I haven't found anything specific. I haven't found anything tangible on that. What was his name? Todd Dillon? Wasn't it John Dillon? John Dillon? I thought it was John Dillon. Wasn't he the spook in the forums? Yes. Later he said he was a spook. He funded RBF. which is replaced by fee. So Bitcoin turned into, like the technocrats, it's a cap-and-trade artificial manufactured scarcity situation where Luke Dash Jr. said, we're going to keep these blocks small. And then this other developer came in and said, oh, okay,

well, we'll make it so that with these small blocks, you have to auction to pay to get your transaction done faster. It's like how carbon credits work. It's a cap-and-trade system. It's absurd. Have you guys actually checked out transactioncity.io? No. So type in T-X-C-I-T-Y.io. So transactioncity, T-X-C-I-T-Y.io. And it's a visualization of transactions on various blockchains. And if you just pull up the BTC blockchain, you can see... to the low C line.

It just has it right there. The BTC one, not the BCH. Let's see. like bitcoin cash has got 40 000 and uh btc's got uh

what transactions 72 82. did it did I lose you steve can we hear you steve is your audio looks like steve's frozen I think he froze are you guys there There you go. There you are. Sorry. Sorry. Yeah. I don't know why. So you guys are there. So yeah, just choose, choose the Bitcoin cash. No, just Bitcoin. Regular bit. I'm talking, we're talking about RBF is Bitcoin. Okay. And then launch it. It's a really cool, I don't know how much of what you heard. I think I may have, um, I may have, uh, zoned out there once I clicked on it,

but it's a visual representation of transactions on the blockchain. which is pretty, uh, pretty revealing. Um, launch, you go and click on launch, just click on launch right there in the middle. Okay. Now, now look at this when it pulls up. I remember this. Yeah. Yeah. Is this the same thing that they were, is it's been around for awhile or is this a new, Yeah, I think it has been around for a while, but this is, you can see the, if you scroll down there on the, on the BTC side, you can see that low fee line. It just, yeah, those are all transactions stuck because they're not paying a high enough fee to

the rent seekers. Well, the miners in this case, but block block stream, if you will. I have, I have Bitcoin cash on the left and I have Bitcoin on the right. It's crazy. You know, There's no waiting line on Bitcoin Cash. Right. Well, because the transactions are so low. Right. It's also usage, of course. You've got exponentially more people using BTC, unfortunately. But anyway, I thought it was a pretty cool visualization of different blockchains. And you can actually see the RBS and skipping lines and how crippled BTC is.

Right. Anyway, I've got to call it a night. I got to get the kids up early in the morning. So yeah, all right. Well, thank you. Thank you for coming on. I really appreciate it. This is very, very helpful. I hope this was a helpful podcast. Yes. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Yeah, this is so this will be on your channel. And any of you is this going to be anywhere else listed? It's going to be on x it's going to be on rumble. It will be it's on YouTube. I'm live streaming it now. And then I will eventually convert it to a podcast. So it'll be on Spotify, Amazon and Apple, Apple podcasts as well. Good deal. I'll repost wherever you post. So thank you for having me.

Great chatting with you. I am in George. I'm gonna make an effort to to make it up to Jersey for your your first event. What date is that again, Aaron? It's 10-5. It's October 5th. Okay. And per our chat earlier, if you can get me some hard dates in November, I'll try to lock something in for Nashville at the library there. Awesome. All right. Sounds good. All right. Good night. Thanks, guys. Have a good night. We'll see you, Aaron. Bye.